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Sminky-Pinky.
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Minks.
3
00:02:47,501 --> 00:02:49,003
You mean like a...
JIV-II
4
00:02:49,211 --> 00:02:50,713
A "V"? All right.
5
00:03:35,924 --> 00:03:37,847
Lots of people say,
"I discovered Alexander McQueen."
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But you don't discover talent.
Talent's there.
7
00:03:42,139 --> 00:03:45,484
You open doors for talent. You push it
through or you help it along.
8
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No one discovered Alexander McQueen.
Alexander McQueen discovered himself.
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Lee had this
very strange CV.
10
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I wasn't very good at school.
11
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I was always drawing clothes
in every lesson,
12
00:04:01,616 --> 00:04:05,211
in science, in biology and...
13
00:04:07,372 --> 00:04:10,592
But I used to enjoy art most.
14
00:04:12,335 --> 00:04:15,009
When he left school
he wasn't sure what he wanted to do.
15
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He was out of work.
Looking for work, I should say.
16
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Because my husband's very strict
on the children going out to work.
17
00:04:23,305 --> 00:04:26,605
We was watching
a television programme one evening
18
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and they was saying
that they couldn't get apprentices
19
00:04:30,812 --> 00:04:32,359
to work in Savile Row.
20
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So I just said to him,
"Why don't you go and try?
21
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"Just knock on the door.
They can only either say yes or no."
22
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And that's exactly what he done.
23
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Anderson and Sheppard
started in 1906.
24
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We like to do things
slightly different to other people.
25
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We have a house style.
26
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That's what we're going to teach
the apprentices to make.
27
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I was taught by a master
tailor from County Cork in Ireland.
28
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He was the best tailor
we had on the premises.
29
00:05:05,305 --> 00:05:06,932
You start off padding collars,
putting in pockets,
30
00:05:08,433 --> 00:05:10,401
but you're expected
to make a full jacket
31
00:05:10,644 --> 00:05:12,646
ready for fitting
by the end of the first year.
32
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As soon as you put it on,
33
00:05:14,147 --> 00:05:16,070
it should fit like a glove
and you know it's made for you.
34
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I knew I couldn't survive in a
place like that for the rest of my life,
35
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cluttered in a small workshop,
sitting on the bench, padding lapels.
36
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But I did have a passion
and I was good at it.
37
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I was good at tailoring a jacket.
I was quick at learning trousers.
38
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I wanted to learn everything.
"Give me everything."
39
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It was
the beginning of the '90s
40
00:05:37,629 --> 00:05:40,178
when I had a bespoke tailoring shop
in Mount Street
41
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and he just walked in one day.
42
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He looked like a skinhead,
43
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but he just told me
he can cut a frock coat
44
00:05:47,514 --> 00:05:50,518
much better
than the 50-year-old tailor I had.
45
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So I was very curious
and I just told him,
46
00:05:54,104 --> 00:05:56,527
"OK, show me what you can do."
47
00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:01,320
I never really made clothes
in a traditional way.
48
00:06:01,403 --> 00:06:03,371
I was experimenting myself
49
00:06:03,780 --> 00:06:07,205
in how to create structure
and volumes.
50
00:06:07,659 --> 00:06:11,880
I'd begun to just take in material,
any material.
51
00:06:12,372 --> 00:06:16,377
And, by putting them all together,
somehow you can start to create
52
00:06:16,585 --> 00:06:18,337
this three-dimensional form.
53
00:06:18,628 --> 00:06:20,471
He wanted to understand
54
00:06:20,630 --> 00:06:23,053
why I'm doing it this way
or that way.
55
00:06:24,134 --> 00:06:28,856
When Lee was 17, he said,
"I'll make you a couple of skirts. ”
56
00:06:29,472 --> 00:06:32,726
And I've got to say,
they fitted like a glove.
57
00:06:32,934 --> 00:06:36,188
They were so fitted to my body
58
00:06:36,313 --> 00:06:38,361
I couldn't even
move my legs, hardly,
59
00:06:38,982 --> 00:06:40,825
but I used to get compliments
on this skirt.
60
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I did use to wonder,
61
00:06:43,528 --> 00:06:46,748
"I hope he finds the right thing
for himself in life."
62
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He was a sweet boy
from the East End,
63
00:06:50,285 --> 00:06:51,878
looking to make money.
64
00:06:52,329 --> 00:06:53,626
We needed technical help,
65
00:06:53,830 --> 00:06:55,377
machinists, pattern cutters.
66
00:06:55,540 --> 00:06:57,759
We needed people
who had hands-on experience
67
00:06:58,001 --> 00:06:59,127
in making clothes.
68
00:06:59,753 --> 00:07:02,222
He gave me no attitude,
was never late,
69
00:07:02,297 --> 00:07:04,550
always knew what he was doing,
always delivered.
70
00:07:05,508 --> 00:07:09,684
He listened continually
to Sinéad O'Connor, which was quite odd.
71
00:07:09,930 --> 00:07:12,353
No one else liked
Sinéad O'Connor at the time
72
00:07:12,515 --> 00:07:14,233
but he really liked her for some reason.
73
00:07:14,392 --> 00:07:17,236
I always remember him with his Walkman
on, listening to Sinéad O'Connor.
74
00:07:17,646 --> 00:07:20,695
Three, two, one, ignition.
75
00:07:21,316 --> 00:07:22,659
Lift-off.
76
00:07:24,778 --> 00:07:28,032
Red or Dead was
this very young streetwear company.
77
00:07:28,615 --> 00:07:30,913
When I said to him
that the Space Baby collection
78
00:07:31,493 --> 00:07:35,248
was based on the anniversary
of the men landing on the moon,
79
00:07:35,622 --> 00:07:36,999
he was like, "What?"
80
00:07:38,208 --> 00:07:40,427
He didn't know
that you could take a subject
81
00:07:40,543 --> 00:07:43,262
that had no relation to clothing
82
00:07:43,755 --> 00:07:46,474
and actually get inspiration from that
to design clothing.
83
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So, he didn't understand
84
00:07:48,343 --> 00:07:50,971
this idea of visual research
85
00:07:51,179 --> 00:07:53,523
or historic references
or sexual references.
86
00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:56,769
We copy you on the ground.
The Eagle has landed.
87
00:07:57,102 --> 00:07:58,945
He must have
asked me questions,
88
00:07:59,437 --> 00:08:01,986
"What can I do next?
How can I push myself forward?"
89
00:08:02,232 --> 00:08:03,700
And at the time
90
00:08:04,442 --> 00:08:07,867
all the designers in Italy
were opening diffusion lines.
91
00:08:09,531 --> 00:08:11,499
He went to Italy with no language,
92
00:08:11,700 --> 00:08:14,544
no place to stay,
no money, no qualifications.
93
00:08:15,328 --> 00:08:19,959
I thought, "Within a week he'll be back
with his tail between his legs."
94
00:08:22,794 --> 00:08:24,967
A week later, maybe 10 days,
95
00:08:25,255 --> 00:08:26,723
I get a call from Lee from Italy.
96
00:08:26,881 --> 00:08:29,634
He'd landed a job
as an assistant for Romeo Gigli.
97
00:08:29,759 --> 00:08:32,638
To say I was shocked
was an understatement.
98
00:08:34,681 --> 00:08:37,525
I said to him,
"OK, I'm looking for a new jacket.
99
00:08:37,642 --> 00:08:39,519
"I have in my mind this shape
100
00:08:39,686 --> 00:08:42,530
"but my tailors,
they cannot reach that shape.
101
00:08:42,689 --> 00:08:44,942
"Maybe you can help me to do it."
102
00:08:45,525 --> 00:08:47,573
And we start to do that jacket
103
00:08:47,777 --> 00:08:49,905
and within the first fitting
104
00:08:50,321 --> 00:08:53,791
I say, "No, it's wrong.
That is not what I'm looking for."
105
00:08:54,492 --> 00:08:58,042
So with the tailor,
with Lee, they did one more.
106
00:08:58,538 --> 00:09:02,384
We did the second fitting
and again I take out the lining,
107
00:09:02,667 --> 00:09:04,965
look inside the jacket
and it was wrong.
108
00:09:05,336 --> 00:09:08,556
Third fitting I say,
"No, it's incorrect."
109
00:09:08,798 --> 00:09:13,349
And I take out the lining
and inside the jacket
110
00:09:13,678 --> 00:09:16,306
Lee wrote with a black pen,
111
00:09:16,681 --> 00:09:18,103
"Fuck you, Romeo."
112
00:09:20,560 --> 00:09:23,734
That was a time
when I was looking for new shapes,
113
00:09:23,980 --> 00:09:25,607
for shapes, for shapes...
114
00:09:25,815 --> 00:09:29,194
And he was looking
so deeply and hard.
115
00:09:29,486 --> 00:09:33,741
He was really deeply looking
to understand everything.
116
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He was leaving my studio
117
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because he wanted to study
more and more and more.
118
00:09:42,165 --> 00:09:43,917
You can't teach talent.
119
00:09:44,125 --> 00:09:48,221
But what you can do is make them better
at what they do, or more professional.
120
00:09:48,505 --> 00:09:51,850
And to me, the whole thinking
behind this MA
121
00:09:52,300 --> 00:09:54,974
was to make them work in teams,
working together,
122
00:09:55,261 --> 00:09:56,979
as you do in the fashion world.
123
00:09:57,597 --> 00:10:00,521
I saw this unprepossessing,
I must say,
124
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very shabby,
125
00:10:02,811 --> 00:10:04,404
very unattractive...
126
00:10:04,521 --> 00:10:07,616
I hate to even say this
but it was true.
127
00:10:08,441 --> 00:10:12,662
...boy with a bundle of clothes
over his arm outside my office.
128
00:10:12,904 --> 00:10:15,327
So I said to him,
"Who are you looking for?"
129
00:10:15,615 --> 00:10:17,834
And he said, "I've come to see you."
130
00:10:18,827 --> 00:10:21,671
But I had no job,
which he said he was after.
131
00:10:21,871 --> 00:10:24,670
The whole thing intrigued me.
He was passionate.
132
00:10:24,749 --> 00:10:27,753
And to me this is the secret, really.
133
00:10:28,586 --> 00:10:30,133
You... If you tap into that.
134
00:10:30,713 --> 00:10:32,681
I found myself saying,
135
00:10:32,799 --> 00:10:34,767
"Well, I think you should come
on my course."
136
00:10:35,093 --> 00:10:38,267
And I couldn't offer him money.
That was really sad.
137
00:10:38,471 --> 00:10:40,144
And it was patently obvious
he had none.
138
00:10:40,390 --> 00:10:42,518
Aunt Renee said
she had money in the bank,
139
00:10:42,809 --> 00:10:45,733
sitting there not doing anything,
and she would rather help Lee.
140
00:10:46,020 --> 00:10:47,772
She'd worked
in the rag trade.
141
00:10:48,022 --> 00:10:50,116
She knew
that Lee had talent.
142
00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:51,902
And he came back and said,
143
00:10:52,026 --> 00:10:54,870
"My aunt is going to pay the fees
144
00:10:55,738 --> 00:10:57,035
"and I'm coming."
145
00:10:58,783 --> 00:11:00,785
Saint Martins
was the place to go.
146
00:11:00,994 --> 00:11:03,372
But what I liked about it
was the freedom of expression
147
00:11:03,580 --> 00:11:05,924
and being surrounded
by like-minded people.
148
00:11:07,625 --> 00:11:12,096
We got on really well because
we had the same sense of humour.
149
00:11:12,422 --> 00:11:16,472
And he laughed all the time,
so he was just funny and disrespectful.
150
00:11:17,427 --> 00:11:22,228
And he'd do catwalk shows down
the corridor. He'd just muck around.
151
00:11:22,307 --> 00:11:24,309
Whenever he could muck around,
he'd muck around.
152
00:11:25,435 --> 00:11:27,529
I was teaching there
at the time as well.
153
00:11:27,812 --> 00:11:30,565
And he was not frightened to tell
people, "I know better than you."
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Even the tutors.
155
00:11:32,817 --> 00:11:36,242
He was a bit of a nightmare student
because he knew so much.
156
00:11:36,654 --> 00:11:39,077
I'm sure he was a pain
and did interrupt people.
157
00:11:39,449 --> 00:11:41,292
He didn't actually dare interrupt me.
158
00:11:41,784 --> 00:11:45,163
But he used it. He used it
as I intended him to use it.
159
00:11:45,580 --> 00:11:48,675
And he'd come to a painting or a book
160
00:11:48,875 --> 00:11:51,128
and, not having had a formal education,
161
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it was all new to him.
162
00:11:53,671 --> 00:11:57,642
And that was it.
He reinterpreted things in his way.
163
00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:00,770
It wasn't filtered through,
as with a lot of us
164
00:12:00,929 --> 00:12:03,853
who'd had
more conventional backgrounds.
165
00:12:04,182 --> 00:12:05,229
I loved that.
166
00:12:05,391 --> 00:12:09,771
He knew where to go for everything.
London was his town.
167
00:12:10,188 --> 00:12:11,565
"Where do I get my buttonholes?"
168
00:12:11,689 --> 00:12:14,363
He'd go,"You want to go
to Martin in Soho."
169
00:12:14,734 --> 00:12:18,238
"If you want fabric, then you want to go
to Berwick Street, Shepherd's Bush."
170
00:12:20,031 --> 00:12:23,752
He would take me to gay bars
and he would take me to lesbian bars
171
00:12:24,244 --> 00:12:25,666
and he'd, like, sit me there
and he'd go,
172
00:12:25,870 --> 00:12:27,622
"This is what you want.
This is what you want."
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00:12:27,872 --> 00:12:31,126
I'd go, "No, I just want to go home.
Can I just go home and do my homework?"
174
00:12:32,293 --> 00:12:35,046
The course always ended
with the degree show.
175
00:12:35,421 --> 00:12:39,426
No other college
had ever been invited, as Iwas,
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to show during British Fashion Week.
177
00:12:42,303 --> 00:12:45,477
He called me when he
was finishing the final collection
178
00:12:45,807 --> 00:12:49,186
and asked me to come in to have a look
and talk to him about it.
179
00:12:49,519 --> 00:12:50,645
It had all the elements.
180
00:12:51,312 --> 00:12:53,690
H had the history of the East End.
181
00:12:53,982 --> 00:12:57,361
It had the darkness,
Jack the Ripper stalks his victims.
182
00:12:57,610 --> 00:13:01,205
It had the research.
It had a really great story behind it.
183
00:13:01,698 --> 00:13:03,996
He was reading books
like Perfume,
184
00:13:04,367 --> 00:13:05,835
which is all about the murder of women,
185
00:13:06,411 --> 00:13:09,540
and he had a very dark side to him
as well,
186
00:13:09,664 --> 00:13:12,292
so he was drawing
from a“ of these influences
187
00:13:12,583 --> 00:13:17,214
and then creating something
very beautiful out of it.
188
00:13:36,482 --> 00:13:40,703
The pieces went past me
and they moved in a way I've never seen.
189
00:13:43,489 --> 00:13:46,618
And I wanted them. They were modern.
They were classical.
190
00:13:51,998 --> 00:13:55,468
He would do a black coat
and then he'd line it with human hair.
191
00:13:55,626 --> 00:13:58,345
And it was blood-red inside
so it was like a body.
192
00:13:58,546 --> 00:14:00,844
It was like flesh with blood.
193
00:14:04,010 --> 00:14:05,353
And I just thought,
194
00:14:05,470 --> 00:14:07,768
"This is the most beautiful thing
I've ever seen."
195
00:14:09,015 --> 00:14:12,861
it was about sabotage and tradition,
which is the perfect combination,
196
00:14:13,102 --> 00:14:14,900
and beauty and violence.
197
00:14:15,313 --> 00:14:18,112
All the things that t suppose
the '90s represent.
198
00:14:20,651 --> 00:14:22,449
How difficult is it
to discover genius?
199
00:14:22,570 --> 00:14:25,198
Not at all difficult,
cos they have it and I spot it.
200
00:14:25,823 --> 00:14:28,622
If you're interested
in late 20th-century clothes,
201
00:14:28,826 --> 00:14:30,828
Isabella Blow is a big player.
202
00:14:31,329 --> 00:14:34,424
I was at American Vogue
and Anna Wintour discovered me
203
00:14:34,582 --> 00:14:37,005
and I worked for her
and then I went to British Vogue.
204
00:14:37,502 --> 00:14:40,346
McQueen was her knight
and she was gonna take him to the top.
205
00:14:40,463 --> 00:14:41,510
She was determined.
206
00:14:41,756 --> 00:14:44,635
I just knew. I rang up his mother
and said, "You've produced a genius."
207
00:14:45,593 --> 00:14:47,891
You know, he's like
the Saint Laurent of the year 2000.
208
00:14:48,262 --> 00:14:49,764
And his mother said to him,
209
00:14:49,847 --> 00:14:53,397
"Look, there's this mad woman
who keeps trying to call us.
210
00:14:53,810 --> 00:14:55,312
"She wants
some of your clothes."
211
00:14:55,436 --> 00:14:57,859
I rang between six
and eight times a day.
212
00:14:57,980 --> 00:15:00,574
Finally I got a little voice
on the end of the line, "Hello?"
213
00:15:01,025 --> 00:15:04,199
I said, "Can I make an appointment
with you? My name's Isabella Blow."
214
00:15:04,404 --> 00:15:06,327
I don't know to this day
if he knew who I was.
215
00:15:06,489 --> 00:15:08,787
No, I just wanted the money.
I was desperate for money.
216
00:15:09,158 --> 00:15:11,707
I wasn't interested in him either.
I just wanted the clothes.
217
00:15:12,036 --> 00:15:13,458
I didn't give her no money off.
218
00:15:13,621 --> 00:15:15,965
I said, "That's 350, love.
You can take it or leave it."
219
00:15:16,374 --> 00:15:18,001
And...
220
00:15:18,209 --> 00:15:19,381
And she loved that.
221
00:15:21,712 --> 00:15:26,309
It wasn't until I went
to the Bluebird Garage collection
222
00:15:26,634 --> 00:15:28,011
that he did that I...
223
00:15:28,761 --> 00:15:31,059
Well, I just thought,
"What have I unleashed?"
224
00:15:31,431 --> 00:15:34,560
And he walked across
and said, "I owe it all to you,"
225
00:15:34,767 --> 00:15:36,861
which I thought was very, very sweet
226
00:15:37,019 --> 00:15:38,737
because it was far from true.
227
00:15:38,813 --> 00:15:43,319
He'd worked every...
Every inch of the way himself.
228
00:15:55,413 --> 00:15:58,838
Every fashion designer wants
to create an illusion,
229
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:02,345
create things that disturb
and fascinate people.
230
00:16:02,503 --> 00:16:04,676
Clothes are really beautiful
to work with,
231
00:16:04,797 --> 00:16:06,674
but there's also a reality outside.
232
00:16:06,757 --> 00:16:08,134
Some people don't want to hear it.
233
00:16:08,342 --> 00:16:11,596
It's all lovey-dovey and everything's
fine in the world all the time.
234
00:16:11,846 --> 00:16:13,098
And I tell it the way it is.
235
00:16:15,433 --> 00:16:18,312
In the '90s,
you used to make clothes to go out.
236
00:16:18,478 --> 00:16:20,526
You used to make something
just for that night.
237
00:16:20,688 --> 00:16:24,363
You're going to this nightclub.
This person is on, or that DJ.
238
00:16:24,650 --> 00:16:26,323
"Right, what are we going to do?"
239
00:16:26,903 --> 00:16:30,077
t think Lee took everything.
t mean, that's one of Lee's strengths.
240
00:16:30,323 --> 00:16:33,247
He took a lot of Bowery/s aesthetic.
241
00:16:33,493 --> 00:16:36,542
It's transgressive, it's in-your-face.
242
00:16:36,913 --> 00:16:40,133
And he thought,
"How does this translate onto a runway?"
243
00:16:40,833 --> 00:16:43,131
Lee also used that language of fetish
244
00:16:43,503 --> 00:16:46,427
in terms of rubber
and latex and leather
245
00:16:47,215 --> 00:16:49,559
and put it into his fashion design.
246
00:16:51,344 --> 00:16:54,848
We started going out with each other
but part of me was thinking,
247
00:16:54,972 --> 00:16:57,851
"But also it's quite useful
cos I can sew as well. "
248
00:16:58,768 --> 00:17:00,611
It was literally anyone that could sew.
249
00:17:00,811 --> 00:17:03,860
It didn't matter whether they were
any good at sewing or not.
250
00:17:04,148 --> 00:17:06,150
Were they willing to come
and sit in the studio
251
00:17:06,275 --> 00:17:07,902
for, like, 16 hours a day?
252
00:17:08,069 --> 00:17:09,946
And were they going to be
fun to be around?
253
00:17:10,071 --> 00:17:14,451
Lee was the badly-behaved,
naughty school boy
254
00:17:14,617 --> 00:17:17,461
that was always doing pranks
on people in the pub,
255
00:17:17,787 --> 00:17:19,960
and that's the person
that I liked and loved.
256
00:17:31,092 --> 00:17:35,188
At the time I first met Lee,
Iwas living in Hoxton Square,
257
00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:37,899
and one day in pops this guy
258
00:17:38,349 --> 00:17:41,853
and I kind of figured he had rented,
you know, the downstairs.
259
00:17:41,978 --> 00:17:44,106
"Come in for a cup of tea.
Come in for a cup of tea."
260
00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:45,777
And he asked what I did.
261
00:17:45,898 --> 00:17:48,742
I said, "Oh, you know, I do grooming
for men, hair and make-up. "
262
00:17:49,151 --> 00:17:51,529
And he goes,
"Oh. I'm having a show soon.
263
00:17:51,612 --> 00:17:53,535
"Would you do the hair and make-up
for the guys?"
264
00:17:53,781 --> 00:17:54,828
And I was like,
265
00:17:54,991 --> 00:17:57,210
"Don't you need to see
some of my work first?"
266
00:17:57,493 --> 00:17:59,495
I'd never done a show before,
you know, so...
267
00:17:59,954 --> 00:18:03,128
And he's like "No, no, no, no.
I can tell. I can tell."
268
00:18:03,624 --> 00:18:06,594
He said to me one day,
"I've decided to do my own collection. "
269
00:18:06,836 --> 00:18:09,931
I remember thinking "How on earth
does he think he's gonna have a business
270
00:18:10,131 --> 00:18:11,303
"and make a collection?
271
00:18:11,549 --> 00:18:16,225
"He's got nothing. He's got no money,
no wherewithal, no studio,
272
00:18:16,596 --> 00:18:19,099
"nobody to support him
and nothing behind him."
273
00:18:19,432 --> 00:18:22,276
And yet he was determined
this was what he was going to do.
274
00:18:23,185 --> 00:18:25,734
I survived on unemployment benefit
275
00:18:26,272 --> 00:18:28,320
and I bought all my fabrics.
276
00:18:29,442 --> 00:18:31,865
I bought all my fabrics
with my dole money.
277
00:18:32,445 --> 00:18:36,291
And I went round to my parents
for baked beans
278
00:18:36,407 --> 00:18:38,956
and tins of soup and things like that.
279
00:18:45,249 --> 00:18:47,126
This is my pooch.
280
00:18:47,376 --> 00:18:49,629
He said to me,
"I really need to get a logo."
281
00:18:49,795 --> 00:18:52,844
We asked my boyfriend at the time
if he would design it.
282
00:18:52,965 --> 00:18:55,138
It was my idea
to put the "C" inside the
283
00:18:55,217 --> 00:18:57,515
but then Dave designed the rest of it.
284
00:18:57,803 --> 00:19:01,603
He was fantastic at getting people to do
a phenomena! amount of work for him.
285
00:19:02,224 --> 00:19:03,851
And we were never, ever paid.
286
00:19:04,018 --> 00:19:07,488
In fact, we were paying him
to work for him.
287
00:19:07,813 --> 00:19:08,860
How amazing is that?
288
00:19:09,065 --> 00:19:12,740
Just to be pan' of it,
be part of his vision, yeah.
289
00:19:13,027 --> 00:19:15,997
He had that, even from
the very beginning, that pull.
290
00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:18,453
It's so bohemian. Warhol.
291
00:19:18,699 --> 00:19:19,746
Yeah.
292
00:19:19,909 --> 00:19:21,877
Dance your way
to success. Come on!
293
00:19:24,622 --> 00:19:26,249
Isabella was very keen
to call him Alexander.
294
00:19:26,374 --> 00:19:28,627
She thought it sounded better
as a designer.
295
00:19:29,001 --> 00:19:31,299
It sounded grander
and more romantic.
296
00:19:31,379 --> 00:19:33,473
Issie got criticised
for trying to make him posh.
297
00:19:33,547 --> 00:19:35,345
So what? Good for Issie.
298
00:19:35,675 --> 00:19:38,098
She was just trying
to make him successful. And she did.
299
00:19:38,219 --> 00:19:39,766
Alexander McQueen is a brand.
300
00:19:40,096 --> 00:19:42,315
Why do you love her
so much, Lee?
301
00:19:42,515 --> 00:19:45,359
Cos she's the same as me.
She doesn't care what people think.
302
00:19:45,768 --> 00:19:47,145
At the end of the day we're...
303
00:19:47,561 --> 00:19:49,734
We're separate entities
to everyone else
304
00:19:49,939 --> 00:19:51,907
and we have our own
personal view about things.
305
00:19:52,274 --> 00:19:54,151
When you fall in love
with something,
306
00:19:54,276 --> 00:19:57,701
you nurture it and you look after it
like it's your... Garden.
307
00:19:58,114 --> 00:20:00,116
People garden, they cook,
they do the same thing.
308
00:20:00,366 --> 00:20:02,039
My ingredients are clothes.
309
00:20:02,660 --> 00:20:05,334
She introduced him to everyone.
She championed him.
310
00:20:05,579 --> 00:20:08,583
So I suppose what initially started
as a work relationship for her
311
00:20:08,666 --> 00:20:10,088
became a creative friendship.
312
00:20:10,167 --> 00:20:12,716
She was someone
that was always really excited
313
00:20:12,837 --> 00:20:14,805
and wanted to see the next thing
and the new thing
314
00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:16,382
and wanted to push people.
315
00:20:16,507 --> 00:20:17,759
It was never about money.
316
00:20:18,300 --> 00:20:21,429
I never saw any money going
backwards and forwards between them.
317
00:20:23,097 --> 00:20:26,692
I just remember the laughter,
the exciting creativity of the mid-'90s.
318
00:20:26,976 --> 00:20:29,695
And the adventure they were on this
rocket they shot to the moon.
319
00:20:30,020 --> 00:20:32,773
I'm sure you're a hungry little thing.
320
00:20:34,108 --> 00:20:36,156
The early days
were very happy days.
321
00:20:36,610 --> 00:20:39,864
They were short times, but they were
beautiful and they were funny.
322
00:20:40,364 --> 00:20:41,832
Issie didn't have children
323
00:20:42,032 --> 00:20:45,787
so she threw her maternal love
to her protégé.
324
00:20:46,495 --> 00:20:49,214
I looked forward to seeing him
cos he made me laugh so much.
325
00:20:49,665 --> 00:20:51,884
Issie and McQueen
had a very dirty sense of humour.
326
00:20:52,293 --> 00:20:54,887
McQueen would describe Issie
as a cross between Lucrezia Borgia
327
00:20:55,004 --> 00:20:56,722
and a Billingsgate fish wife.
328
00:20:57,465 --> 00:20:59,513
Issie had a very vulgar humour.
329
00:20:59,717 --> 00:21:02,220
I always found the cocks
and the cunts slightly...
330
00:21:03,012 --> 00:21:04,685
Always a bit... Oh!
331
00:21:05,181 --> 00:21:07,479
I wasn't really into
their earthy humour.
332
00:21:08,058 --> 00:21:10,527
However rude McQueen got,
Issie was even worse.
333
00:21:10,728 --> 00:21:13,948
They loved to play off each other
like that and be outrageous.
334
00:21:14,023 --> 00:21:15,400
I know Alexander loves birds
335
00:21:15,566 --> 00:21:17,534
so I've got this bird hat on
designed by Philip.
336
00:21:17,985 --> 00:21:21,330
We're going to do some falconry tomorrow
cos Alexander's got a very...
337
00:21:21,822 --> 00:21:23,290
He's passionate about birds.
338
00:21:23,532 --> 00:21:25,660
We're going to fly some falcons
tomorrow afternoon.
339
00:21:47,097 --> 00:21:49,395
We did go and stay
at Hines a few times.
340
00:21:50,267 --> 00:21:52,861
You would end up
diving into Issie's dressing-up box
341
00:21:53,062 --> 00:21:54,359
and we'd all be wearing
342
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:56,858
fantastical costumes for dinner
and things like that.
343
00:21:58,692 --> 00:22:01,161
The world she inhabited
was so far removed
344
00:22:01,570 --> 00:22:04,119
from the world
that any of us had come from.
345
00:22:05,866 --> 00:22:07,413
There was a sort of unreality to it.
346
00:22:07,660 --> 00:22:11,915
Whenever we went to that house,
you just felt so at home.
347
00:22:12,665 --> 00:22:15,509
And I think Lee felt very at home there.
348
00:22:16,627 --> 00:22:20,757
(Detmaq They had this big sister, a fun
person to be with, who was outrageous.
349
00:22:21,173 --> 00:22:23,141
With Issie,
"Be as different as you can.
350
00:22:23,509 --> 00:22:25,386
"And keep going!
351
00:22:25,594 --> 00:22:27,938
"The more different,
the more I love it."
352
00:22:29,139 --> 00:22:31,233
I really don't like the norm.
I don't think it's...
353
00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:33,227
You don't move forwards, seriously.
354
00:22:33,352 --> 00:22:35,571
You just don't move forward
if you play safe.
355
00:22:35,896 --> 00:22:37,739
You really do piss a lot of people off.
356
00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,123
His first shows
were unbelievable.
357
00:22:46,365 --> 00:22:47,742
People were winded by them.
358
00:22:47,825 --> 00:22:51,125
People walked out.
Quite a few acerbic reviews.
359
00:22:51,412 --> 00:22:54,666
But everything else before
paled into comparison.
360
00:22:54,832 --> 00:22:56,926
I don't wanna do a show
that you walk out of
361
00:22:57,001 --> 00:22:59,845
feeling like you've
just had Sunday lunch.
362
00:22:59,962 --> 00:23:05,469
I want you to come out
either feeling repulsed or exhilarated.
363
00:23:05,718 --> 00:23:07,470
As long as it's an emotion.
364
00:23:07,928 --> 00:23:11,353
If you leave without emotion,
then I'm not doing myjob properly.
365
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:12,687
So that's that.
366
00:23:12,766 --> 00:23:16,191
That's the thing about Alexander.
I think his clothes are very emotional.
367
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:19,023
This coat is, like, based on a tramp,
368
00:23:19,273 --> 00:23:21,321
so it's based on someone
who hasn't got any money,
369
00:23:21,817 --> 00:23:23,819
standing in the street,
nowhere to sleep.
370
00:23:24,486 --> 00:23:26,580
You wrap it round yourself,
you feel fantastic.
371
00:23:26,989 --> 00:23:29,868
Then you have
all this passion and love
372
00:23:30,451 --> 00:23:33,546
and slashing
and sex and romance.
373
00:23:34,955 --> 00:23:37,549
The idea of the collection
was never to produce.
374
00:23:38,459 --> 00:23:40,461
The shows were all about publicity
375
00:23:40,836 --> 00:23:45,342
and creating a marketing ploy
for Alexander McQueen, the designer.
376
00:23:45,799 --> 00:23:47,301
They were
impossible to reproduce.
377
00:23:47,468 --> 00:23:49,891
They were made of plastic bags
or masking tape.
378
00:23:50,095 --> 00:23:51,187
They were show clothes.
379
00:23:51,639 --> 00:23:53,232
Lee started doing bumsters.
380
00:23:53,432 --> 00:23:56,231
These were cut so low that you could see
the model's pubic hair.
381
00:23:56,644 --> 00:23:58,692
It's nothing to do
with pubic hair.
382
00:23:58,979 --> 00:24:01,528
It's just a technical thing where,
as a tailor,
383
00:24:01,774 --> 00:24:03,651
you're breaking up the proportion
of the body
384
00:24:04,151 --> 00:24:06,574
by lowering the trousers,
elongating the torso.
385
00:24:06,946 --> 00:24:08,368
It's nothing to do with bum cleavage.
386
00:24:08,489 --> 00:24:10,867
It's an added bonus
if you've got a nice bum.
387
00:24:11,241 --> 00:24:12,584
He told that mannequin,
388
00:24:12,743 --> 00:24:15,166
"Put your pubic hairs
in Anna Wintoufs face."
389
00:24:17,790 --> 00:24:19,633
It's just funny, naughty behaviour.
390
00:24:20,459 --> 00:24:22,461
You could give Alexander £500
391
00:24:22,711 --> 00:24:24,713
and he could produce
30 pieces of clothing.
392
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:28,259
He saw some cling film and said
"I'm gonna make a dress out of that. "
393
00:24:28,509 --> 00:24:30,682
'Tm going to put the model in it,
wrap her up."
394
00:24:30,970 --> 00:24:32,893
And he just cut this dress,
put a zip in it
395
00:24:33,013 --> 00:24:34,606
and suddenly that went down the runway.
396
00:24:34,974 --> 00:24:38,069
Getting a tyre
and running it over the suit.
397
00:24:39,728 --> 00:24:41,196
Things like that. Just genius.
398
00:24:41,772 --> 00:24:43,365
£4 worth of lace.
399
00:24:43,607 --> 00:24:45,325
Invisible zip, £1.
400
00:24:45,776 --> 00:24:47,619
Sprayed with car spray paint.
401
00:24:47,820 --> 00:24:50,664
They probably cost less than £10,
those dresses, to make.
402
00:24:50,864 --> 00:24:54,494
But, through that weird alchemy
of being cut and made by Lee,
403
00:24:54,702 --> 00:24:56,579
suddenly they're being requested.
404
00:24:57,162 --> 00:24:59,790
Avedon wanted to have
this dress for Sharon Stone.
405
00:24:59,999 --> 00:25:01,842
So it has to be in America now.
406
00:25:02,126 --> 00:25:04,879
"We need someone to fly over
with the dress on Concorde."
407
00:25:05,004 --> 00:25:08,349
That still upsets me to this day.
I didn't get to go on Concorde.
408
00:25:10,300 --> 00:25:11,643
It was me.
409
00:25:12,469 --> 00:25:14,517
That's almost the period
where I think,
410
00:25:14,722 --> 00:25:16,645
the madness really kicked in.
411
00:25:16,974 --> 00:25:19,898
The show was brilliant
but I'll wake up tomorrow and think,
412
00:25:20,144 --> 00:25:23,114
"I've got to get a bottle of milk.
Where am I going to get 42p from?"
413
00:25:23,439 --> 00:25:24,907
We went to a McDonald's.
414
00:25:25,232 --> 00:25:27,485
We got two cheeseburgers,
two fries, two Cokes.
415
00:25:28,110 --> 00:25:30,033
And I was that tired
that I just dropped the tray
416
00:25:30,237 --> 00:25:32,615
and then we had to pick
the food up off the floor.
417
00:25:33,198 --> 00:25:35,292
And I thought,
"This is a weird world,
418
00:25:35,409 --> 00:25:37,958
"that you've just shown the finale
of London Fashion Week
419
00:25:38,078 --> 00:25:39,705
"but we haven't got five quid to eat."
420
00:25:39,830 --> 00:25:42,049
That's how it is.
People have got to understand that.
421
00:25:42,207 --> 00:25:45,211
You're doing fucking fab shows
but you've got to start living.
422
00:25:45,377 --> 00:25:47,505
The Clothes Show,
you know, BBC One.
423
00:25:47,629 --> 00:25:50,508
At the time 12 million viewers.
You're 22 years old.
424
00:25:50,799 --> 00:25:52,472
You're not in any of the shots
425
00:25:52,885 --> 00:25:56,185
and you're dictating the terms
on how you're going to appear.
426
00:25:56,263 --> 00:25:57,890
Because I was doing the shows
427
00:25:58,015 --> 00:26:00,438
on money that I got
from unemployment benefit,
428
00:26:00,517 --> 00:26:02,861
I could not afford
to show my face on camera
429
00:26:02,978 --> 00:26:06,278
because I would be arrested
for working as well as signing on.
430
00:26:06,523 --> 00:26:08,196
- Did it piss you off?
- No.
431
00:26:08,442 --> 00:26:10,115
It should have done.
That was the idea.
432
00:26:10,319 --> 00:26:12,572
I really worked
that East End yob,
433
00:26:12,738 --> 00:26:17,460
this juxtaposition between a hooligan
and someone that uses a needle.
434
00:26:17,576 --> 00:26:19,044
And people couldn't fathom it.
435
00:26:19,369 --> 00:26:21,622
So it was new.
It was a breath of fresh air.
436
00:26:22,206 --> 00:26:25,085
Savile Row, Cockney geezer,
ding dong, all of that.
437
00:26:25,167 --> 00:26:27,420
He was aware
how seductive that was.
438
00:26:28,003 --> 00:26:29,926
I get a bit annoyed
when I read that.
439
00:26:31,340 --> 00:26:33,058
He was far from a bad boy.
440
00:26:33,467 --> 00:26:37,517
In fact, he was a very loving,
happy child
441
00:26:37,679 --> 00:26:39,397
and very generous.
442
00:26:40,015 --> 00:26:41,688
Beautiful face, huh?
443
00:26:43,185 --> 00:26:46,530
I just remember this one time
when I went round his house.
444
00:26:46,855 --> 00:26:49,950
I think I said something was shit
or something in front of his mum.
445
00:26:50,150 --> 00:26:51,902
He turned round,
glared at me and said,
446
00:26:51,985 --> 00:26:54,909
"Don't you fucking swear
in front of my fucking mother."
447
00:26:55,155 --> 00:26:57,954
We were never
what people called poor.
448
00:26:58,158 --> 00:27:00,581
My husband was a London taxi driver.
449
00:27:01,286 --> 00:27:02,754
Even though there was six children,
450
00:27:02,913 --> 00:27:05,507
they all had everything
that they should have had.
451
00:27:05,666 --> 00:27:08,135
I don't know, it just seems...
452
00:27:09,419 --> 00:27:12,673
Like, honest,
an honest place round here.
453
00:27:12,798 --> 00:27:15,802
You know where you stand,
if you know what I mean.
454
00:27:15,926 --> 00:27:18,725
If someone's going to mug you,
they tell you before they do it.
455
00:27:18,846 --> 00:27:20,348
I'm onlyjoking.
456
00:27:22,057 --> 00:27:24,401
From our granddads,
he got the sense of humour,
457
00:27:24,518 --> 00:27:26,361
which was, at times, wicked.
458
00:27:31,483 --> 00:27:34,282
I think that he struggled
coming out of that background
459
00:27:34,403 --> 00:27:35,905
and going into the world.
460
00:27:35,988 --> 00:27:37,990
I made the choice
to come out to my father.
461
00:27:38,115 --> 00:27:39,788
I'd told all my brothers
and sisters and aunts,
462
00:27:39,908 --> 00:27:42,252
but my father was a London taxi driver.
463
00:27:42,327 --> 00:27:43,920
He would come home at night and say,
464
00:27:43,996 --> 00:27:46,670
"God, I nearly run over
a bloody queer last night in Soho."
465
00:27:46,874 --> 00:27:48,046
I'd have to deal with this.
466
00:27:48,167 --> 00:27:52,092
My dad could be a bit cutting sometimes,
but he was joking.
467
00:27:52,504 --> 00:27:56,509
And if you didn't know him,
you'd probably take that the wrong way.
468
00:27:57,342 --> 00:28:00,687
Lee's father was saying,
"Sell your clothes in Brick Lane,"
469
00:28:01,096 --> 00:28:03,599
never quite understanding
what Lee was doing.
470
00:28:04,099 --> 00:28:07,103
My dad wanted me to be
some sort of mechanic or something,
471
00:28:07,311 --> 00:28:09,689
but... It never worked out that way.
472
00:28:12,149 --> 00:28:14,618
From our nan
he got that storytelling,
473
00:28:14,860 --> 00:28:17,329
that dark romance
of the Victorian times.
474
00:28:17,821 --> 00:28:21,166
I think that really lent itself
to his visions
475
00:28:21,408 --> 00:28:23,502
of the stories
that he wanted to tell.
476
00:28:24,411 --> 00:28:25,754
It's all right, Mother.
477
00:28:30,334 --> 00:28:32,336
Oh, Mother, come here.
No, I'm too ugly.
478
00:28:36,673 --> 00:28:40,052
She was very strong
and powerful
479
00:28:40,385 --> 00:28:42,604
and quite a lot was unsaid,
480
00:28:42,846 --> 00:28:46,020
but, my God, you realised there was
a really strong bond between them.
481
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:48,944
She made him feel
like he could do anything.
482
00:28:50,771 --> 00:28:53,399
I always encouraged them to read
483
00:28:54,066 --> 00:28:55,409
and have lots of books
484
00:28:56,068 --> 00:28:59,197
because I myself loved history
and things like that.
485
00:29:00,781 --> 00:29:03,204
That's one about a Highland clan.
486
00:29:03,408 --> 00:29:06,912
She was looking into
the genealogy of the McQueen family
487
00:29:07,329 --> 00:29:09,331
and aimed at proving
488
00:29:09,957 --> 00:29:12,710
that the McQueens came
from McQueens of the Isle of Skye.
489
00:29:13,210 --> 00:29:14,928
It opened up his world.
490
00:29:15,045 --> 00:29:18,720
He was born in Stratford, but he knew
there was this other life for him
491
00:29:19,174 --> 00:29:20,676
which came from Scotland.
492
00:29:21,009 --> 00:29:22,761
She encouraged
the sort of fantasy
493
00:29:22,970 --> 00:29:24,972
and excitement of those stories
494
00:29:25,097 --> 00:29:26,394
and Lee went with it.
495
00:29:28,183 --> 00:29:32,108
You have two types of Scotland
people will associate themselves with,
496
00:29:32,312 --> 00:29:36,237
the Vivienne Westwood romantic Scotland,
swathes of tartan silk.
497
00:29:37,192 --> 00:29:40,071
My ancestry
is the Jacobites of Scotland.
498
00:29:40,779 --> 00:29:43,498
The war of the English and the Scottish
499
00:29:43,615 --> 00:29:47,461
where the English raped loads of women,
killed clans completely off.
500
00:29:47,911 --> 00:29:50,505
It's like a form of genocide.
It was then.
501
00:29:50,580 --> 00:29:52,207
And people don't realise this.
502
00:29:52,416 --> 00:29:55,215
I mean, take Bosnia.
How many dead people have you seen?
503
00:29:55,627 --> 00:29:57,254
There's millions of dead people
in Bosnia.
504
00:29:57,337 --> 00:29:58,680
It's just genocide in the end.
505
00:29:58,839 --> 00:30:01,809
People have got to realise that
it still goes on in the world today.
506
00:30:11,935 --> 00:30:13,983
There was something different
about him.
507
00:30:14,146 --> 00:30:19,824
He had this artistic energy in him
rather than like a fashion designer.
508
00:30:21,903 --> 00:30:25,032
I rang his mother and said,
"I want to work for your son."
509
00:30:26,658 --> 00:30:30,538
She gave rne the address
and I went one morning
510
00:30:30,787 --> 00:30:33,757
and ever since,
we were working every day
511
00:30:34,207 --> 00:30:36,175
on the Highland Rape collection,
512
00:30:36,418 --> 00:30:38,591
trying to get the pieces ready.
513
00:30:39,504 --> 00:30:40,630
There were times
514
00:30:40,714 --> 00:30:44,218
when he hadn't yet started working
on the collection and it was due soon
515
00:30:44,343 --> 00:30:46,471
and he would do one drawing
after another,
516
00:30:46,595 --> 00:30:48,814
after another, after another,
after another
517
00:30:49,014 --> 00:30:50,732
and there was a collection
in one evening.
518
00:30:50,974 --> 00:30:53,272
Very quick, very fluid.
519
00:30:53,894 --> 00:30:56,192
He was also very creative
at night.
520
00:30:56,438 --> 00:30:58,861
His adrenaline was much more alive
521
00:30:59,107 --> 00:31:01,485
and we usually used to put music.
522
00:31:02,402 --> 00:31:05,997
He would listen to the piano
and it became very important.
523
00:31:06,406 --> 00:31:09,910
The composer Michael Nyman
became part of his team.
524
00:31:11,203 --> 00:31:13,877
I was just enjoying myself
to watch him
525
00:31:14,081 --> 00:31:16,300
because he was sitting
like an old lady,
526
00:31:16,500 --> 00:31:19,219
his needle and his thimble.
527
00:31:19,711 --> 00:31:21,588
You can feel like he's...
528
00:31:21,922 --> 00:31:24,516
It's kind of a therapeutic work for him.
529
00:31:25,801 --> 00:31:27,474
He went into a sort of zone.
530
00:31:27,719 --> 00:31:29,596
I always used to say
his eyes went black
531
00:31:29,888 --> 00:31:32,141
because he suddenly was focusing
on what he was doing
532
00:31:32,307 --> 00:31:34,856
and he almost couldn't hear
anybody else.
533
00:31:36,228 --> 00:31:38,322
He could draft a jacket,
free-hand,
534
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,110
just with a piece of chalk,
so he wasn't using measurements.
535
00:31:42,192 --> 00:31:45,162
He could just, from his eye,
read someone's body measurements
536
00:31:45,278 --> 00:31:48,077
and then be able to draw that out
onto a bit of cloth.
537
00:31:48,782 --> 00:31:50,534
At heart, Lee was a romantic,
538
00:31:50,867 --> 00:31:53,916
and that romantic is because
of that physical relationship
539
00:31:54,121 --> 00:31:55,543
to what you produce,
540
00:31:55,664 --> 00:31:58,508
which then comes back
to that idea of craft in a way.
541
00:32:03,255 --> 00:32:05,633
The family always got
invites to the shows.
542
00:32:05,799 --> 00:32:07,642
It was very important
that my nan was there.
543
00:32:07,843 --> 00:32:09,971
He really wanted to make my nan proud.
544
00:32:10,303 --> 00:32:15,025
Aunt Renee and Mum made sure
that the models had some sandwiches.
545
00:32:15,225 --> 00:32:17,774
Mum would have probably done
her sausage rolls.
546
00:32:17,936 --> 00:32:22,191
We were all, as a group
of young, really cool, English models,
547
00:32:22,357 --> 00:32:26,737
so excited to see this man
that had this reputation.
548
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:30,824
I was just amazed.
All these people, photographers...
549
00:32:31,366 --> 00:32:35,667
And I thought, "My God,
they're all here to see Lee.
550
00:32:36,037 --> 00:32:37,664
"I hope they're not disappointed."
551
00:32:37,831 --> 00:32:39,674
Because I thought,
552
00:32:39,833 --> 00:32:41,710
"This is just Lee from Stratford."
553
00:32:55,682 --> 00:32:57,684
The darkness,
554
00:32:58,518 --> 00:33:01,818
the going to the depths
and the recesses of one's mind
555
00:33:02,105 --> 00:33:05,484
to come up with such things
like Highland Rape.
556
00:33:05,609 --> 00:33:09,830
"I'm going to send down loads of girls
who look like they've just been raped."
557
00:33:10,739 --> 00:33:14,915
And then we were all looking
like we'd come out of a hedge backwards
558
00:33:14,993 --> 00:33:17,121
and I was going,
"Is this the hair and make-up?"
559
00:33:21,291 --> 00:33:23,635
They're not easy garments
to look at.
560
00:33:23,877 --> 00:33:26,847
They do look like something
from a crime scene.
561
00:33:35,597 --> 00:33:39,477
I honestly just thought
that he really just didn't like women,
562
00:33:39,768 --> 00:33:42,362
he didn't like the models,
he didn't like anything,
563
00:33:42,521 --> 00:33:44,398
he was just trying to torture us all.
564
00:33:44,648 --> 00:33:46,446
But his vision,
565
00:33:46,691 --> 00:33:48,364
when you actually came down,
566
00:33:48,818 --> 00:33:49,990
and the silhouette
567
00:33:50,195 --> 00:33:53,290
and the way he made you look
was so extraordinary.
568
00:33:54,491 --> 00:33:57,586
I don't think I really understood,
because I was 15 at the time,
569
00:33:57,744 --> 00:34:01,044
exactly what was going on
or the connotations of it.
570
00:34:01,998 --> 00:34:05,343
It wasn't until probably the next day
that I read the newspapers.
571
00:34:06,294 --> 00:34:08,296
And, you know,
there was quite a backlash
572
00:34:08,380 --> 00:34:09,802
of the statement of the show.
573
00:34:10,173 --> 00:34:12,175
I mean, it was pretty intense.
574
00:34:12,384 --> 00:34:16,981
But he made every single headline
and that's what he wanted to do.
575
00:34:17,514 --> 00:34:19,357
And he sure got it.
576
00:34:19,933 --> 00:34:21,776
Judith Church,
MP for Dagenham,
577
00:34:21,935 --> 00:34:24,108
thought there was no excuse
for such a show.
578
00:34:24,437 --> 00:34:27,156
The very title of the show,
Highland Rape,
579
00:34:27,274 --> 00:34:30,198
has been done to shock people.
It's been done to attract publicity.
580
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:32,829
It has succeeded
and that, in a way, is sad,
581
00:34:32,988 --> 00:34:34,865
because I think women want
to look at fashion,
582
00:34:34,948 --> 00:34:36,291
but they don't want to see it
583
00:34:36,408 --> 00:34:38,911
in some way
as portraying them as a victim.
584
00:34:40,620 --> 00:34:43,624
I'm not a misogynist.
The idea was saying to the public,
585
00:34:43,999 --> 00:34:47,344
"A man takes from a woman.
The woman's not giving it."
586
00:34:47,502 --> 00:34:48,719
That's what rape is.
587
00:34:48,837 --> 00:34:51,681
My oldest sister was badly beaten up
by her husband.
588
00:34:52,007 --> 00:34:55,181
When you're eight years old and you see
your sister strangled by her husband,
589
00:34:55,468 --> 00:34:57,015
who's now dead, thank God,
590
00:34:57,554 --> 00:35:00,774
you know, all you wanna do
is make women look stronger.
591
00:35:01,683 --> 00:35:04,436
You might not like the honesty
he was presenting you with,
592
00:35:04,561 --> 00:35:07,235
you might find it distasteful,
shocking or aggressive
593
00:35:07,564 --> 00:35:11,239
or misogynistic,
but for him it was his truth.
594
00:35:11,943 --> 00:35:14,241
Those garments all tell you about Lee
595
00:35:14,404 --> 00:35:16,202
and they're almost like confessional.
596
00:35:16,573 --> 00:35:19,577
They do relate to things
that happened in his childhood.
597
00:35:21,494 --> 00:35:24,589
We were just in our flat. It was
literally in the middle of the evening.
598
00:35:24,664 --> 00:35:27,008
And he said,
"Oh, by the way, I was abused
599
00:35:27,375 --> 00:35:29,594
"when I was a child
by my brother-in-law. "
600
00:35:29,794 --> 00:35:33,344
It just came out
and he started crying
601
00:35:33,590 --> 00:35:35,763
and then we started talking
602
00:35:36,176 --> 00:35:38,770
and then, almost as soon
as he started telling me all that,
603
00:35:39,012 --> 00:35:41,515
he said, "Anyway, t don't want
to talk about that any more."
604
00:35:41,723 --> 00:35:44,442
The stuff that he saw,
I mean, the violence against my mum,
605
00:35:44,643 --> 00:35:48,864
the abuse he suffered by my dad
and the abuse my mum suffered by Dad...
606
00:35:49,147 --> 00:35:52,492
They had that affinity together.
They shared that, Lee and my mum.
607
00:35:53,068 --> 00:35:56,322
They were both affected
by the same person.
608
00:35:57,739 --> 00:36:01,164
And they had that connection
through that, you know.
609
00:36:01,368 --> 00:36:04,542
And Lee saw my mum
very much like a mother figure
610
00:36:05,205 --> 00:36:08,880
and somebody
that he wanted to protect,
611
00:36:09,167 --> 00:36:11,340
but my mum wanted to protect him
as well.
612
00:36:12,796 --> 00:36:16,801
I had quite a big burden
on my shoulders.
613
00:36:17,509 --> 00:36:18,977
Erm...
614
00:36:20,637 --> 00:36:23,561
But I'd always felt close to Lee
615
00:36:24,099 --> 00:36:25,146
and...
616
00:36:27,227 --> 00:36:32,984
In the early years, Lee had seen
things like domestic violence and,
617
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:40,332
at the time, it must have also had
an effect on his mind.
618
00:36:41,574 --> 00:36:43,372
And that stuff he had to get out,
619
00:36:43,618 --> 00:36:45,495
I think it was a way
of exercising his demons,
620
00:36:45,662 --> 00:36:50,133
a way of protecting women and himself
by creating these strong women
621
00:36:50,417 --> 00:36:52,215
who looked like they had armour on.
622
00:36:52,377 --> 00:36:54,471
It was armour for his heart as well,
you know, so...
623
00:36:56,965 --> 00:36:58,717
The relationship
between me and Lee,
624
00:36:59,008 --> 00:37:00,726
I joke that it was four seasons long,
625
00:37:01,177 --> 00:37:04,397
purely because I think those collections
and those shows became markers
626
00:37:04,472 --> 00:37:10,104
in terms of how our work life
was also tied up with our relationship.
627
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:11,817
And, looking back on it now,
628
00:37:11,980 --> 00:37:13,857
I can see the reasons
why it would be...
629
00:37:13,982 --> 00:37:15,825
How could a relationship work
630
00:37:16,484 --> 00:37:19,658
with all the things
that were going on in his life,
631
00:37:19,863 --> 00:37:21,865
all the things in his past?
632
00:37:22,115 --> 00:37:25,790
I can't think of any relationship
that would be able to deal with that.
633
00:37:51,728 --> 00:37:55,699
When you went to St Martins,
in the first year you'd go to Paris
634
00:37:55,940 --> 00:37:59,319
and the idea is that you're meant
to go to exhibitions.
635
00:37:59,819 --> 00:38:01,537
But we would just spend all of our time
636
00:38:01,738 --> 00:38:04,207
wangling our way
into the various shows.
637
00:38:04,407 --> 00:38:06,034
So we went to this show and it was...
638
00:38:06,242 --> 00:38:09,746
It was all very floral
and there was chiffon and Lee was going,
639
00:38:09,954 --> 00:38:12,207
"Well, that's rubbish.
That's rubbish. Oh, my God.
640
00:38:12,457 --> 00:38:14,835
"This is just the worst show ever.
Bloody hell.
641
00:38:15,043 --> 00:38:16,966
"Givenchy, that's a load of crap!
642
00:38:17,170 --> 00:38:18,797
"That's for, like, old ladies.
643
00:38:19,130 --> 00:38:22,851
"I never, ever want to work
somewhere like that."
644
00:38:34,479 --> 00:38:37,278
It was a really exciting time
to be covering the industry
645
00:38:37,482 --> 00:38:39,450
because it was changing,
it was evolving.
646
00:38:39,651 --> 00:38:42,871
People like Bernard Arnault
were buying up small family brands
647
00:38:43,238 --> 00:38:45,491
and then turning them
into global corporations.
648
00:38:45,657 --> 00:38:47,785
And first he brought in John Galliano
649
00:38:47,909 --> 00:38:50,332
and, after two years,
moved John over to Dior
650
00:38:50,453 --> 00:38:52,876
and then needed another
new, young, hot flavour
651
00:38:53,122 --> 00:38:54,624
for Givenchy.
652
00:38:54,707 --> 00:38:56,755
And so he said...
Why did he want you?
653
00:38:56,918 --> 00:39:00,047
He said when I was hired
that I was his horse.
654
00:39:01,047 --> 00:39:03,141
I don't know if that's in looks
or what, but...
655
00:39:04,509 --> 00:39:06,728
But he said I was his horse
he betted on.
656
00:39:07,095 --> 00:39:10,440
I was living with Lee
when Givenchy called
657
00:39:10,515 --> 00:39:14,110
and he thought that they wanted him
to design a handbag.
658
00:39:14,227 --> 00:39:15,945
And I'm like "Wow. WOW!"
659
00:39:16,688 --> 00:39:18,406
"Cool man!" You know?
660
00:39:18,565 --> 00:39:21,159
Next thing I know
661
00:39:21,359 --> 00:39:24,033
he comes in
and he basically says
662
00:39:24,195 --> 00:39:27,244
they've asked him to be
creative director of Givenchy.
663
00:39:27,407 --> 00:39:30,035
And I was like, "You are kidding me!"
664
00:39:30,285 --> 00:39:34,131
He called me at work and then he said,
"They've offered me this job.
665
00:39:34,330 --> 00:39:36,458
"If I move to Paris,
will you come with me?"
666
00:39:36,541 --> 00:39:37,963
I was like, "Yeah, of course."
667
00:39:38,126 --> 00:39:42,222
It was sort of exciting
and also quite scary as well
668
00:39:42,380 --> 00:39:45,259
because it was still that honeymoon
period of our relationship.
669
00:39:45,842 --> 00:39:49,437
Why did you go to Givenchy,
having already created your own name,
670
00:39:49,512 --> 00:39:52,857
having won British Designer of the Year
twice in a row?
671
00:39:53,349 --> 00:39:55,317
For one reason,
the money was good.
672
00:39:55,894 --> 00:39:58,022
But what do I do
with the money from Givenchy?
673
00:39:58,313 --> 00:40:01,533
I put it straight back into McQueen.
It helps me employ people for McQueen
674
00:40:01,608 --> 00:40:03,110
to build my own company up.
675
00:40:04,235 --> 00:40:07,205
Very talented people
that he brought with him to Givenchy.
676
00:40:07,322 --> 00:40:08,369
What a team!
677
00:40:08,656 --> 00:40:11,535
He told me,
"I will need a team to work with me
678
00:40:11,784 --> 00:40:14,003
"so I was thinking of you.
679
00:40:14,329 --> 00:40:17,208
"So, think about it
and let me know."
680
00:40:17,498 --> 00:40:20,001
There's nothing to think about.
Of course, I'll take the job.
681
00:40:21,711 --> 00:40:24,715
We took an aeroplane
from City Airport.
682
00:40:25,423 --> 00:40:29,428
We were the weirdest people
in the plane. It was all businessmen.
683
00:40:29,636 --> 00:40:32,230
And we were there
with our bleached jeans,
684
00:40:32,931 --> 00:40:34,478
with a lot of attitude.
685
00:40:35,308 --> 00:40:37,310
Where did you find this?
In Japan.
686
00:40:39,354 --> 00:40:41,027
Really?
Yeah.
687
00:40:44,692 --> 00:40:46,535
Oh, oh!
688
00:40:48,988 --> 00:40:51,707
There was huge excitement.
Cos imagine being that age
689
00:40:51,950 --> 00:40:54,453
and you're being given
that amount of, one, responsibility
690
00:40:54,869 --> 00:40:56,212
and also that amount of money.
691
00:40:57,705 --> 00:40:58,797
Statue!
692
00:41:00,333 --> 00:41:01,710
There's Sebastién Pons.
693
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:03,553
Hello, Sebastién!
694
00:41:04,170 --> 00:41:05,763
- Sweaty armpits.
- Come on!
695
00:41:05,964 --> 00:41:07,261
God, you've got wet patches.
696
00:41:07,715 --> 00:41:10,969
I think that in the McQueen studio
I was a little bit like the bouffant
697
00:41:11,177 --> 00:41:12,554
because I was
the funny one there.
698
00:41:12,637 --> 00:41:14,935
They were taking the piss
out of my accent.
699
00:41:15,264 --> 00:41:17,733
A Spanish bouffant in a British court.
700
00:41:19,227 --> 00:41:20,479
Simon Costin.
701
00:41:20,687 --> 00:41:22,689
God, you're looking
fairly gross today.
702
00:41:23,690 --> 00:41:27,365
I saw myself as the person
that put things into context.
703
00:41:27,527 --> 00:41:29,905
The set was always there to reflect
704
00:41:30,196 --> 00:41:33,325
the sort of untold story
of the collection.
705
00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:36,669
There was Katy, of course,
Katy England.
706
00:41:36,828 --> 00:41:39,456
Katy's the most important part
of McQueen.
707
00:41:40,373 --> 00:41:41,875
Camera up, please.
708
00:41:42,208 --> 00:41:44,210
She's the Tweedledee
to my Tweedledum.
709
00:41:44,460 --> 00:41:46,337
She fuels my imagination.
710
00:41:47,171 --> 00:41:49,299
I help research the collection.
711
00:41:49,799 --> 00:41:53,679
I, erm, bring things to his attention
712
00:41:53,970 --> 00:41:56,098
that I think might be
important in fashion.
713
00:41:56,389 --> 00:41:59,268
Basically, I'm always there
at the right-hand side.
714
00:41:59,642 --> 00:42:02,862
Shaun Leane was very much involved
in the business, making jewellery.
715
00:42:03,312 --> 00:42:04,438
What do you think, eh?
716
00:42:05,064 --> 00:42:06,236
Fancy a dance?
717
00:42:06,482 --> 00:42:09,076
For me to do work Hke this
is very good for me.
718
00:42:09,318 --> 00:42:11,366
It allows me to go
from one extreme to the other.
719
00:42:11,529 --> 00:42:14,783
And now I'm going into different areas.
I'm working with body jewellery
720
00:42:15,241 --> 00:42:18,120
and it's really going
into a form of sculpture.
721
00:42:19,078 --> 00:42:20,421
Sarah Burton.
722
00:42:20,621 --> 00:42:22,168
Sarah was the intern.
723
00:42:22,331 --> 00:42:23,958
He looked at us
724
00:42:24,083 --> 00:42:26,177
like the sort of pillars
725
00:42:26,544 --> 00:42:28,797
that would make him feel secure.
726
00:42:30,631 --> 00:42:32,508
We had this really nice flat.
727
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:40,729
I loved the area. I mean...
Place des Vosges. I mean, hello?
728
00:42:42,477 --> 00:42:44,320
Oh, God, that's pretty scary.
729
00:42:45,438 --> 00:42:47,406
Thinking about it now,
it was tiny.
730
00:42:47,940 --> 00:42:50,159
When I would come over
to start working on the set,
731
00:42:50,401 --> 00:42:51,778
I'd be on the sofa.
732
00:42:55,573 --> 00:42:57,200
Ooh, ooh!
733
00:42:57,867 --> 00:42:59,665
Sebastién!
734
00:43:00,078 --> 00:43:01,671
Oh, language!
735
00:43:03,498 --> 00:43:06,172
I always ended up
sleeping in Lee's room
736
00:43:06,626 --> 00:43:09,630
because Lee was always
collapsing on the sofa.
737
00:43:09,921 --> 00:43:10,968
Lee!
738
00:43:12,632 --> 00:43:15,135
- You changed the pillows.
- Yeah, fucking right.
739
00:43:18,221 --> 00:43:20,724
We had a driver
so we got driven everywhere.
740
00:43:20,848 --> 00:43:22,850
Oh, wait a minute,
he's gone blurry.
741
00:43:23,309 --> 00:43:24,481
That's better.
742
00:43:24,644 --> 00:43:26,112
Say hello to the people
of England.
743
00:43:28,773 --> 00:43:29,945
Such fun.
744
00:43:31,275 --> 00:43:33,448
We can do
some funny tricks.
745
00:43:34,278 --> 00:43:36,531
Hello, I'm on speed, baby.
746
00:43:40,660 --> 00:43:42,458
When we arrived at Givenchy,
747
00:43:42,787 --> 00:43:44,539
everybody was kind of like
748
00:43:44,747 --> 00:43:47,500
bending their head to him
749
00:43:47,917 --> 00:43:49,919
and calling him
Monsieur McQueen,
750
00:43:50,294 --> 00:43:53,969
which was like, "They're calling you
Monsieur McQueen? Here?"
751
00:43:57,718 --> 00:43:59,516
Cath! Woo-ooh!
752
00:44:01,222 --> 00:44:03,475
When we arrived
I think they were in shock.
753
00:44:03,599 --> 00:44:06,102
The way we dress,
the way we work
754
00:44:06,269 --> 00:44:08,613
and the jokes we made.
755
00:44:09,188 --> 00:44:11,532
Obviously it was very grand,
with chandeliers,
756
00:44:11,858 --> 00:44:14,577
so it was very different
from the working environment in London
757
00:44:14,819 --> 00:44:18,073
which was a very, very small room,
chaotic, with stuff everywhere.
758
00:44:18,489 --> 00:44:20,287
Here I have my own office.
759
00:44:20,449 --> 00:44:22,952
I pick up the phone
and I get what I want.
760
00:44:23,661 --> 00:44:25,834
Cos I want it,
I want it, I want it!
761
00:44:26,164 --> 00:44:27,416
So I ask for it.
762
00:44:27,707 --> 00:44:31,177
We was just like a bunch
of young kids running about in Givenchy.
763
00:44:32,336 --> 00:44:34,384
Were they surprised
you were chosen?
764
00:44:34,839 --> 00:44:38,935
Well, I think that it put most people
in a coma when I got chosen!
765
00:44:41,345 --> 00:44:43,063
All of a sudden,
we're there,
766
00:44:43,222 --> 00:44:46,066
sitting in Hubert de Givenchy's house,
767
00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:49,939
looking out the window
and you see the Balenciaga sign
768
00:44:50,062 --> 00:44:52,064
and you knew
that Yves Saint Laurent was there
769
00:44:52,231 --> 00:44:54,575
and knowing that John Galliano was there
770
00:44:54,734 --> 00:44:57,328
at Avenue Montaigne,
just a few yards from there.
771
00:44:57,653 --> 00:45:00,281
And there we are
with Alexander McQueen,
772
00:45:00,406 --> 00:45:02,659
being the new talk of the town.
773
00:45:02,992 --> 00:45:05,165
And I felt special.
774
00:45:06,495 --> 00:45:08,372
He was trying
to find his feet there.
775
00:45:08,539 --> 00:45:10,462
He obviously had to make
a huge impression
776
00:45:10,625 --> 00:45:12,502
because it was his first collection.
777
00:45:13,502 --> 00:45:15,129
I remember telling Lee,
778
00:45:15,213 --> 00:45:17,511
"Everybodys looking at us
and we have nothing."
779
00:45:17,590 --> 00:45:19,092
And he always would answer,
780
00:45:19,300 --> 00:45:21,018
"Don't worry, Sebastién,
we'll get it done."
781
00:45:37,151 --> 00:45:40,997
This is Paris and Paris chic.
This is Givenchy, this is not McQueen.
782
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,910
This is where elegant suits are made
and fantastic fabrics are used.
783
00:45:45,159 --> 00:45:47,878
I mean, it's going to take
my own label, McQueen,
784
00:45:48,037 --> 00:45:50,631
another 40 years
to get the reputation this one has.
785
00:45:51,207 --> 00:45:54,461
I remember once
we saw this beautiful work.
786
00:45:54,710 --> 00:45:58,681
Lee asked Catherine DeLondres,
who was in charge of the atelier,
787
00:45:59,090 --> 00:46:01,218
"Who's done this fabulous work?"
788
00:46:01,425 --> 00:46:03,302
"She's not allowed to come in."
789
00:46:03,511 --> 00:46:05,639
He's like, "What do you mean,
she's not allowed in?
790
00:46:05,763 --> 00:46:06,810
"Please let her in."
791
00:46:07,390 --> 00:46:11,691
I remember from that day on
Lee wanted to see the person
792
00:46:12,395 --> 00:46:14,693
who has worked directly
with the garment.
793
00:46:15,898 --> 00:46:17,946
And I think they loved that.
794
00:46:18,401 --> 00:46:20,244
This is the Bet Lynch dress.
795
00:46:21,821 --> 00:46:24,950
And we also treated it,
bonding plastic over the top
796
00:46:25,866 --> 00:46:29,086
for raincoats
so you get the whole ensemble.
797
00:46:29,412 --> 00:46:31,005
None of us spoke French
798
00:46:31,122 --> 00:46:34,217
and the French atelier
didn't speak English.
799
00:46:34,542 --> 00:46:37,762
Lee would actually draw in the air
how it would have to be.
800
00:46:38,296 --> 00:46:41,721
Yeah. Yeah, it's OK.
801
00:46:44,385 --> 00:46:47,355
Oh, it's OK.
I thought it was just pantalon.
802
00:47:09,869 --> 00:47:13,669
They're quite precise and like...
They, like, take the threads out and...
803
00:47:13,998 --> 00:47:16,092
I just get the scissors
and go, "Whack it off!"
804
00:47:16,584 --> 00:47:18,427
And they go...
Like that.
805
00:47:19,962 --> 00:47:21,714
And I go, "It's OK, it's only clothes."
806
00:47:22,006 --> 00:47:24,429
I'll never forget
the expression on her face.
807
00:47:24,508 --> 00:47:27,637
But in the end she saw
exactly what he was doing.
808
00:47:27,762 --> 00:47:28,809
She was in awe.
809
00:47:28,971 --> 00:47:33,021
A very mutual, you know, respect
grew between the two of them.
810
00:47:33,225 --> 00:47:36,399
Haute couture is about
the atelier. I come from Savile Row.
811
00:47:36,687 --> 00:47:38,655
So I have great respect for the tailors.
812
00:47:38,731 --> 00:47:41,154
They deserve just as much praise
as I do.
813
00:47:42,485 --> 00:47:45,284
Lee, one day he said,
"Where can we go and eat'?
814
00:47:45,488 --> 00:47:47,115
"Where do the workers eat?"
815
00:47:47,323 --> 00:47:49,542
And then Catherine said,
"There is a canteen
816
00:47:49,825 --> 00:47:51,702
"in the basement for the workers."
817
00:47:51,827 --> 00:47:53,704
And Lee was like, "So let's go there."
818
00:47:53,871 --> 00:47:57,592
When we went down there,
the people, they're flipping out.
819
00:47:57,792 --> 00:47:59,920
"Alexander is eating with us!"
820
00:48:00,836 --> 00:48:02,304
They couldn't believe it.
821
00:48:02,421 --> 00:48:06,676
These fashion houses, they treat
the designer like he's a king.
822
00:48:07,009 --> 00:48:09,057
And they treated Lee
like a king,
823
00:48:09,303 --> 00:48:11,226
but Lee didn't want
to behave like a king,
824
00:48:11,305 --> 00:48:13,683
Lee wanted to behave
like a regular person.
825
00:48:17,895 --> 00:48:19,363
OK.
826
00:48:19,814 --> 00:48:21,157
The ideas for the show,
827
00:48:21,482 --> 00:48:24,110
they grew out of the collection
as the collection developed.
828
00:48:24,652 --> 00:48:27,326
He would pull threads
and stories out of that.
829
00:48:28,072 --> 00:48:31,167
And there was always mood boards
and things pinned all over the walls.
830
00:48:31,325 --> 00:48:34,044
Everyone fed in.
it was a very group practice.
831
00:48:34,286 --> 00:48:36,960
But Lee was the spider
in the centre of the web, as it were,
832
00:48:37,206 --> 00:48:39,459
pulling everything together
and distilling
833
00:48:39,667 --> 00:48:41,510
what it was that he had in his head.
834
00:48:41,752 --> 00:48:44,301
I remember the fraughtness
about a week before the show
835
00:48:44,672 --> 00:48:48,051
with things coming down and not right
and things having to be changed.
836
00:48:48,300 --> 00:48:50,519
It was really insanely crazy.
837
00:48:50,636 --> 00:48:52,354
The pressure was super intense.
838
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:13,542
In 25 days
to put a 55-outfit collection together
839
00:49:13,826 --> 00:49:15,328
is not an easy task.
840
00:49:18,330 --> 00:49:22,301
The first couture show
had the theme of the Golden Fleece,
841
00:49:22,501 --> 00:49:23,753
Jason and the Argonauts.
842
00:49:25,296 --> 00:49:27,014
They wanted it to be amazing.
843
00:49:28,507 --> 00:49:31,727
My first feeling
from Alex's description was,
844
00:49:32,094 --> 00:49:35,018
they had to be warriors
845
00:49:35,347 --> 00:49:37,395
mixed with goddesses.
846
00:49:37,683 --> 00:49:40,357
I said, "We do horns?"
He said, "Yeah, but do big."
847
00:49:40,644 --> 00:49:43,488
I said, "But how big?"
He said, "You know Genghis Khan?
848
00:49:43,647 --> 00:49:45,149
"He's the junior size.
849
00:49:45,357 --> 00:49:46,404
"Give me the senior."
850
00:49:46,692 --> 00:49:49,445
It's the 19th of January 1997
851
00:49:49,778 --> 00:49:53,282
and, as they say in the trade,
we're about to witness a fashion moment.
852
00:49:53,407 --> 00:49:55,375
At the tender age of 27,
853
00:49:55,451 --> 00:49:58,000
British Designer of the Year
Alexander McQueen
854
00:49:58,204 --> 00:50:01,333
is about to show
his first haute couture collection.
855
00:50:15,554 --> 00:50:17,898
Every model had
to have a character,
856
00:50:18,098 --> 00:50:20,442
an identity, a signature.
857
00:50:20,976 --> 00:50:23,946
Every single girl could have been
a show on her own.
858
00:50:25,314 --> 00:50:28,363
Where did the inspiration
come from? He told me, "From the logo."
859
00:50:28,859 --> 00:50:33,330
The logo is the Gs,
which looks like a Greek motif,
860
00:50:33,948 --> 00:50:36,497
and the Givenchy label
is white and gold.
861
00:50:37,952 --> 00:50:41,456
Always with Lee's collections,
there were some pieces where you'd go,
862
00:50:41,830 --> 00:50:44,253
"God, that's rather risqué."
863
00:50:45,209 --> 00:50:48,258
I think a tot of the press
focused on the ones
864
00:50:48,462 --> 00:50:52,433
that were a little bit more crazy
or a little bit, you know, unwearable.
865
00:50:53,551 --> 00:50:55,724
French designers
were complaining and saying,
866
00:50:55,970 --> 00:50:59,645
"Oh, they're not even French
and they're taking over Givenchy.
867
00:50:59,807 --> 00:51:01,559
"Look what he's doing to Givenchy."
868
00:51:01,850 --> 00:51:03,568
I think it was them saying,
869
00:51:04,144 --> 00:51:05,737
"I'm still gonna be who I am,
870
00:51:05,813 --> 00:51:07,861
"regardless that you put me
in this posh space.
871
00:51:08,190 --> 00:51:09,692
"I'm still who I am."
872
00:51:10,192 --> 00:51:12,695
I liked that, that they stayed true
to who they were.
873
00:51:13,028 --> 00:51:16,953
They actually brought England into Paris
in their own unique way.
874
00:51:20,077 --> 00:51:22,330
People were talking,
fashion editors.
875
00:51:22,538 --> 00:51:24,882
"He has a big mouth.
He has a big head.
876
00:51:25,207 --> 00:51:27,005
"Oh, the British!
What does he think?"
877
00:51:27,376 --> 00:51:31,802
And then I understood that basically
the world was against him.
878
00:51:32,381 --> 00:51:34,008
And you do your first show.
879
00:51:34,091 --> 00:51:37,265
It's not a huge success.
No, that's true.
880
00:51:37,386 --> 00:51:39,605
Well done.
881
00:51:39,805 --> 00:51:43,560
They were wishing
to see him crash and be destroyed.
882
00:51:44,101 --> 00:51:45,819
They have claws and knives
883
00:51:46,020 --> 00:51:47,613
and they're throwing everything
into your back,
884
00:51:47,688 --> 00:51:49,440
which is fine cos I'm a good fighter!
885
00:51:51,275 --> 00:51:53,198
I remember us afterwards.
886
00:51:53,402 --> 00:51:54,699
You know, Lee was...
887
00:51:56,280 --> 00:51:58,078
Oh, hellish, yeah.
888
00:51:58,324 --> 00:52:01,544
That was a really horrid night.
It was a difficult night after that.
889
00:52:02,828 --> 00:52:05,297
A few punches and arguments.
890
00:52:11,629 --> 00:52:13,631
I think he's done a lot
with the house,
891
00:52:13,756 --> 00:52:15,758
because Givenchy
have had a lot of press.
892
00:52:15,924 --> 00:52:19,804
It's a more difficult thing to deal with
cos McQueen is McQueen in London.
893
00:52:20,054 --> 00:52:23,900
Givenchy is taking over
from another man in Paris.
894
00:52:24,058 --> 00:52:27,232
As Alexander says,"It's like taking
a dinosaur out of the sea."
895
00:52:27,519 --> 00:52:30,489
And I think in one season
he's done that.
896
00:52:30,856 --> 00:52:34,702
So I think in a year
he will have done 20 times that.
897
00:52:35,944 --> 00:52:37,571
Givenchy changed everything.
898
00:52:37,946 --> 00:52:39,414
The fun times were over.
899
00:52:39,865 --> 00:52:41,583
I had an accountant who spoke French.
900
00:52:41,784 --> 00:52:43,661
They were going to Paris
to sign the deal.
901
00:52:43,869 --> 00:52:46,918
And I said, "Please, make sure
Issie gets something out of it."
902
00:52:47,122 --> 00:52:48,544
And then I kind of did ask McQueen
903
00:52:48,707 --> 00:52:50,755
and he said,
"Issie and I are not about money."
904
00:52:51,168 --> 00:52:54,593
When the money did come
and Alexander cut her out...
905
00:52:55,339 --> 00:52:56,511
That was very tough.
906
00:52:57,007 --> 00:52:59,806
Their friendship changed.
She was so hurt at this rejection.
907
00:53:00,135 --> 00:53:03,309
She'd have created a buzz.
She'd have had a salon at Givenchy.
908
00:53:03,639 --> 00:53:06,358
She'd have made it
the most happening place in Paris.
909
00:53:09,186 --> 00:53:14,864
I do remember going to Hilles
straight after the takeover at Givenchy.
910
00:53:16,652 --> 00:53:21,203
You cannot imagine the tension
between the two of them in this room.
911
00:53:21,699 --> 00:53:24,794
These designers think
that you made me.
912
00:53:25,703 --> 00:53:28,331
- And it's never been about that.
- No, they don't.
913
00:53:28,580 --> 00:53:30,708
- I know that that's...
- But they do!
914
00:53:30,791 --> 00:53:34,671
You see it all the time in the press!
They say, "Oh, Isabella Blow,
915
00:53:34,837 --> 00:53:37,590
"responsible for Philip Treacy
and Alexander McQueen."
916
00:53:37,881 --> 00:53:40,009
- No, they say...
- They do just say that!
917
00:53:40,676 --> 00:53:43,429
But it's never been
about that for me and you.
918
00:53:43,554 --> 00:53:45,022
Whether I was part of it?
919
00:53:45,180 --> 00:53:46,898
Does that annoy you
that they put a strap on it?
920
00:53:46,974 --> 00:53:49,568
"As discovered by Isabella Blow."
Does it piss you off?
921
00:53:49,727 --> 00:53:52,697
No, not at all, because Issie
has helped me a lot in that way,
922
00:53:52,855 --> 00:53:54,698
but not in the way that she's like...
923
00:53:55,149 --> 00:53:57,151
She does it
because she loves my clothes,
924
00:53:57,234 --> 00:53:58,531
not because she loves me.
925
00:53:58,694 --> 00:54:01,072
Exactly. That's the point.
926
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:03,032
Because I can't stand her guts!
927
00:54:04,783 --> 00:54:06,160
I'm joking.
928
00:54:06,702 --> 00:54:10,377
I do remember sitting there,
thinking to myself,
929
00:54:10,664 --> 00:54:14,259
"Please, lay off Issie
because she's done nothing but help you,
930
00:54:14,543 --> 00:54:17,296
"but you seem to be giving her
a really difficult time."
931
00:54:17,671 --> 00:54:19,173
Issie kingmaker.
932
00:54:19,423 --> 00:54:22,267
This is the man she championed
and then he resented that
933
00:54:22,384 --> 00:54:23,727
and wanted to be his own man
934
00:54:24,011 --> 00:54:26,890
so there was no position
for Isabella Blow at Givenchy.
935
00:54:27,931 --> 00:54:28,978
Punishment.
936
00:54:29,850 --> 00:54:32,399
And I remember
McQueen turned to me and said,
937
00:54:32,478 --> 00:54:34,321
"I'm the tycoon now, Detmar."
938
00:54:34,938 --> 00:54:36,611
And it wasn't meant affectionately.
939
00:54:36,940 --> 00:54:39,693
We had a policy. Don't show hurt,
don't show weakness.
940
00:54:39,985 --> 00:54:42,534
Keep your head up,
keep proud, keep fighting.
941
00:54:42,946 --> 00:54:44,914
Something will turn up. It's got to.
942
00:54:45,115 --> 00:54:48,164
His star ascended
and hers didn't as much
943
00:54:48,368 --> 00:54:50,871
and, you know,
he slightly abandoned her.
944
00:54:51,497 --> 00:54:54,341
Then Issie suddenly got
this job at The Sunday Times
945
00:54:54,500 --> 00:54:57,549
and McQueen said,
"You've been resurrected, Issie. "
946
00:54:57,711 --> 00:55:00,009
And I thought, "No thanks to you, mate."
947
00:55:02,633 --> 00:55:06,263
I saw myself within the press
and in the public eye as the gazelle.
948
00:55:06,970 --> 00:55:08,643
And the gazelle always got eaten.
949
00:55:09,473 --> 00:55:12,852
And that's how I see human life.
We can all be discarded quite easily.
950
00:55:13,185 --> 00:55:16,860
The fragility of a designer's time
in the press.
951
00:55:17,314 --> 00:55:18,907
You're there, you're gone.
952
00:55:20,734 --> 00:55:21,951
It's a jungle out there.
953
00:55:22,945 --> 00:55:25,198
I went to his London studio
954
00:55:25,447 --> 00:55:27,666
and he was talking
about a haute couture show.
955
00:55:28,033 --> 00:55:31,037
"I tried to please them
and then I fucked it up.
956
00:55:31,203 --> 00:55:32,750
"I'm gonna do my own thing.
957
00:55:32,996 --> 00:55:35,215
"It's gonna be very McQueen,
the next one.
958
00:55:35,457 --> 00:55:39,587
"Fuck you! Fuck you, all of you.
I'm gonna show you."
959
00:55:39,878 --> 00:55:43,303
We went from this sort of...
The hallowed halls of Givenchy
960
00:55:43,841 --> 00:55:46,344
into the sort of rough,
gritty Borough Market,
961
00:55:46,510 --> 00:55:48,933
people just sweeping
all the rotting fruit and veg up.
962
00:55:49,096 --> 00:55:51,599
It's nice to show them
the rough pan' of London,
963
00:55:51,765 --> 00:55:54,609
make them a bit scared, look over
their shoulder once in a while.
964
00:55:54,768 --> 00:55:56,315
It's nothing to do
with couture.
965
00:55:56,436 --> 00:55:57,813
Now you've got your own studio.
966
00:55:57,855 --> 00:56:01,450
We're in another chapter,
in another world, in another McQueen.
967
00:56:01,650 --> 00:56:04,324
All camera crews
go round the front gate.
968
00:56:04,444 --> 00:56:06,117
The London shows were always...
969
00:56:06,321 --> 00:56:08,323
The audience,
the expectation, was so great.
970
00:56:08,490 --> 00:56:12,336
The shows in Paris
were far more formal and reserved.
971
00:56:12,536 --> 00:56:14,630
People would scream
their heads off in London.
972
00:56:17,499 --> 00:56:22,471
It was crazy, people literally
fighting to see the catwalk.
973
00:56:23,714 --> 00:56:25,842
Lee just running
from model to model
974
00:56:26,008 --> 00:56:27,931
and screaming and shouting at everyone.
975
00:56:28,093 --> 00:56:30,846
Simon, we want to start
the show!
976
00:56:31,305 --> 00:56:34,559
And just always moving,
always dressing, always stressing.
977
00:56:35,017 --> 00:56:37,691
Stressing and dressing,
actually, together.
978
00:56:38,145 --> 00:56:40,022
Are we all standing by,
ready to go?
979
00:56:40,147 --> 00:56:41,319
OK.
980
00:56:41,481 --> 00:56:43,859
Where's Russell?
Is he out there? Is he getting ready?
981
00:56:44,151 --> 00:56:45,323
Yeah.
982
00:56:45,903 --> 00:56:47,621
One of the models was late.
983
00:56:47,696 --> 00:56:50,415
He said, "Fuck her"
and he started the show.
984
00:56:50,699 --> 00:56:53,373
He'd just go,
"Right, Jodes, just go for it. "
985
00:56:53,660 --> 00:56:54,832
He used to psyche me up.
986
00:56:54,953 --> 00:56:57,297
I used to literally get out
onto the catwalk and go...
987
00:57:06,089 --> 00:57:07,682
It was really the first time
988
00:57:07,841 --> 00:57:11,687
the collection kind of seeped out
into everything,
989
00:57:11,887 --> 00:57:15,983
from the energy that was in that space
to the effect it had on people.
990
00:57:17,225 --> 00:57:20,695
A sort of angst, an anger and fear,
991
00:57:20,938 --> 00:57:22,986
that was woven through that show.
992
00:57:24,149 --> 00:57:25,651
We were mind-blown
993
00:57:25,776 --> 00:57:28,950
because they didn't look like models.
994
00:57:29,154 --> 00:57:32,328
They look like animals
with this big hair
995
00:57:32,574 --> 00:57:34,451
and this animal make-up.
996
00:57:34,826 --> 00:57:35,873
It was like...
997
00:57:36,453 --> 00:57:38,080
It was intense.
998
00:57:40,624 --> 00:57:42,501
Some students
that weren't allowed in
999
00:57:42,834 --> 00:57:46,259
stormed the barricades
and kicked over a“ these fire pots.
1000
00:57:47,005 --> 00:57:49,007
And then
the fire started.
1001
00:57:49,633 --> 00:57:51,476
Cos there were a pile
of crashed cars
1002
00:57:51,843 --> 00:57:55,063
and I don't think
we'd emptied the cars of petrol.
1003
00:57:55,347 --> 00:57:57,065
The car's actually on fire.
1004
00:57:57,683 --> 00:58:00,653
There's a fricking car on fire
on the catwalk.
1005
00:58:00,936 --> 00:58:03,155
And everyone thought
it was part of the show.
1006
00:58:03,522 --> 00:58:06,901
"Don't you...dare go out there
with fire extinguishers.
1007
00:58:07,067 --> 00:58:09,866
"Just keep sending them out.
Keep sending them out."
1008
00:58:11,571 --> 00:58:15,166
Had that not been rectified,
that whole tent
1009
00:58:15,659 --> 00:58:19,835
and all the top fashion editors
and models would have been history.
1010
00:58:21,123 --> 00:58:27,096
That's just back to typical,
wonderful, mad, brilliant Lee.
1011
00:58:53,113 --> 00:58:55,992
Did you move out of London
and settle in Paris?
1012
00:58:56,450 --> 00:58:59,579
I stay in both. I'm here for six months
and in London six months. All over.
1013
00:59:00,245 --> 00:59:03,715
My dog is in London and I'm missing him.
I'm missing my dog.
1014
00:59:11,548 --> 00:59:15,348
TraveHing between the two cities
to do Givenchy and McQueen,
1015
00:59:15,469 --> 00:59:17,767
of course it would take its toll.
1016
00:59:18,972 --> 00:59:20,269
But he did it.
1017
00:59:20,515 --> 00:59:22,859
And he managed
to make the shows amazing.
1018
00:59:26,813 --> 00:59:29,692
By that time
there was so much more pressure
1019
00:59:29,900 --> 00:59:32,949
because he was also doing his own line
and then having to do
1020
00:59:33,153 --> 00:59:34,826
ready-to-wear and couture.
1021
00:59:34,946 --> 00:59:37,620
You could see the beginning
of the pressure that Lee was under.
1022
00:59:37,866 --> 00:59:41,291
The favourite company
of LVMH was Dior.
1023
00:59:41,661 --> 00:59:46,007
Lee felt they were really
comparing him with Galliano.
1024
00:59:46,917 --> 00:59:48,965
And then he sort of found out
1025
00:59:49,127 --> 00:59:53,007
that John had
four times more budget than him
1026
00:59:53,340 --> 00:59:55,934
to create his haute couture collection.
1027
00:59:56,718 --> 00:59:59,767
The house we loved
was the McQueen house.
1028
01:00:00,222 --> 01:00:02,941
Givenchy was like a stepbrother.
1029
01:00:03,475 --> 01:00:07,571
We knew that our time there
had an expiry date.
1030
01:00:09,231 --> 01:00:14,112
When we arrived at Paris
Lee's clothes tended to be very rigid
1031
01:00:14,569 --> 01:00:16,367
and I think in Paris
1032
01:00:16,530 --> 01:00:19,283
he got to discover
the soft side of things.
1033
01:00:20,450 --> 01:00:24,000
We took that
and we brought it to London.
1034
01:00:26,123 --> 01:00:29,548
For No. 13, I remember him very happy.
1035
01:00:29,668 --> 01:00:34,174
Lee had it very clear in his head
what he wanted to do.
1036
01:00:35,048 --> 01:00:36,891
We all left the meeting thinking,
1037
01:00:37,008 --> 01:00:38,976
"Oh, my God,
he has it very dear this season."
1038
01:00:39,136 --> 01:00:41,264
"He knows what colours,
he knows the shape..."
1039
01:00:41,429 --> 01:00:44,683
He himself was feeling at peace.
1040
01:00:47,352 --> 01:00:51,232
The first show I ever worked on
with Lee, he liked the idea of robots.
1041
01:00:51,690 --> 01:00:53,408
Lee kept going on about it,
1042
01:00:53,608 --> 01:00:55,531
"Oh, I'm gonna have this robot,
this model. "
1043
01:00:55,861 --> 01:00:59,991
And we were like "Oh, no!
The robots again. Oh, my God."
1044
01:01:02,367 --> 01:01:03,994
We were just hoping
he was gonna forget the idea.
1045
01:01:04,286 --> 01:01:07,881
But then, the night before the show,
the robot did turn up
1046
01:01:08,039 --> 01:01:10,792
and we didn't have a dress
to go with the robot.
1047
01:01:11,084 --> 01:01:12,427
I went back to the studio.
1048
01:01:12,544 --> 01:01:16,048
I was like, "Guys, we need
to make a dress for the finale."
1049
01:01:16,339 --> 01:01:19,843
We went under the table
and pulled all these jewels out
1050
01:01:20,093 --> 01:01:22,562
and he was like,
"Hey, there's the dress."
1051
01:01:30,562 --> 01:01:32,189
They told him it was impossible
1052
01:01:32,272 --> 01:01:34,445
and he said, "No, it's not.
You can do it."
1053
01:01:34,858 --> 01:01:38,328
That's what Lee did for people,
he made them do the impossible.
1054
01:01:39,237 --> 01:01:42,537
We got some technician down
to operate the robots and Lee was,
1055
01:01:42,699 --> 01:01:44,872
"Oh, yeah, let's make the robots
do more of this."
1056
01:01:45,035 --> 01:01:47,208
He's directing these robots
like they're actors
1057
01:01:47,579 --> 01:01:51,709
and, consequently, you end up
with this incredible choreography,
1058
01:01:51,917 --> 01:01:53,260
her spinning.
1059
01:01:54,628 --> 01:01:57,757
You had Shalom Harlow there
and these two robots going round.
1060
01:01:58,006 --> 01:02:01,135
And the thing is, the robots looked
like they had a mind of their own.
1061
01:02:20,654 --> 01:02:24,534
I think that's the first time
that I was blown away by my own show.
1062
01:02:25,367 --> 01:02:28,712
That man and machine thing at the end
was... I'm still in shock, really.
1063
01:02:28,912 --> 01:02:30,914
It's the first time I've cried
at my show, so...
1064
01:02:31,665 --> 01:02:32,712
Yeah.
1065
01:03:03,530 --> 01:03:05,203
Lee was living his dream.
1066
01:03:05,532 --> 01:03:08,536
He would never have given the work up,
as hard as it was,
1067
01:03:08,702 --> 01:03:11,171
because you get that one chance in life.
1068
01:03:13,290 --> 01:03:17,090
The first time I knew that Lee
was actually getting very famous
1069
01:03:17,252 --> 01:03:19,721
was when some stranger
came up to us
1070
01:03:19,879 --> 01:03:21,927
in the supermarket
and asked for his autograph.
1071
01:03:22,215 --> 01:03:25,640
And I remember him saying to me,
"Oh, my God, that's so scary."
1072
01:03:26,177 --> 01:03:29,181
And I realised then
that something was happening.
1073
01:03:29,347 --> 01:03:32,521
He was breaking outside of fashion
and becoming famous.
1074
01:03:34,144 --> 01:03:36,647
That whole celebrity thing,
people chasing after him.
1075
01:03:36,938 --> 01:03:38,360
You got the feeling he was saying,
1076
01:03:38,481 --> 01:03:41,109
"This is not the important thing.
This fame is nonsense.
1077
01:03:41,609 --> 01:03:43,828
"The important thing is what I do."
1078
01:03:44,863 --> 01:03:47,036
I sometimes wish
he'd had a normal life
1079
01:03:47,115 --> 01:03:50,244
and that he could just be
a normal person
1080
01:03:50,869 --> 01:03:54,669
in terms of not having that pressure
of everything at such a young age.
1081
01:03:55,040 --> 01:03:59,136
I knew Lee when he had nothing
but a rubbish bin full of clothes,
1082
01:03:59,294 --> 01:04:03,265
so I saw very quickly
him become a millionaire and more.
1083
01:04:03,673 --> 01:04:07,519
And the more money he had,
he seemed to be more unhappy.
1084
01:04:08,803 --> 01:04:10,396
With the money came drugs.
1085
01:04:11,014 --> 01:04:12,391
And that was the sad thing.
1086
01:04:36,956 --> 01:04:38,333
When did it become bad?
1087
01:04:38,666 --> 01:04:42,045
Well, it became bad when the pressure
became too much for him
1088
01:04:42,212 --> 01:04:45,261
and he obviously started dealing with it
1089
01:04:45,465 --> 01:04:49,220
in ways he shouldn't have,
unfortunately.
1090
01:04:49,677 --> 01:04:51,771
With cocaine
came an aggressiveness,
1091
01:04:52,180 --> 01:04:54,683
that kind of anger,
that sort of paranoia.
1092
01:04:55,475 --> 01:04:57,352
He still made some great clothes,
1093
01:04:57,435 --> 01:04:59,233
but the personality changed.
1094
01:04:59,354 --> 01:05:03,200
All the hard work I do.
I do 10 collections a year.
1095
01:05:03,358 --> 01:05:04,530
And it's hard work.
1096
01:05:04,692 --> 01:05:07,320
I didn't go to Givenchy,
they come to me.
1097
01:05:07,529 --> 01:05:09,782
I got really upset
when people started saying
1098
01:05:10,073 --> 01:05:12,792
I was gonna get fired
when it wasn't true.
1099
01:05:12,992 --> 01:05:14,835
"Sod the lot of you.
I do what I like."
1100
01:05:18,164 --> 01:05:19,757
There was definitely a change
1101
01:05:19,916 --> 01:05:21,884
and definitely a move
in our relationship.
1102
01:05:22,043 --> 01:05:24,216
He had two sides to him.
1103
01:05:24,712 --> 01:05:27,181
He could come
in a super cool mood,
1104
01:05:27,507 --> 01:05:30,977
like, full of laughter and that,
1105
01:05:31,052 --> 01:05:32,725
or it could be
1106
01:05:33,012 --> 01:05:34,685
a devil crossing the door.
1107
01:05:34,973 --> 01:05:37,442
He was obviously
a very troubled person
1108
01:05:38,226 --> 01:05:40,069
and the darkness created
1109
01:05:40,353 --> 01:05:44,358
this amazing creativity
and genius artist.
1110
01:05:48,027 --> 01:05:51,156
T had a tattoo saying McQueen on my arm.
1111
01:05:51,823 --> 01:05:53,700
I got it covered up
and when he found out,
1112
01:05:53,867 --> 01:05:55,790
that was kind of like the end
of everything.
1113
01:05:57,162 --> 01:05:58,505
Lee was a romantic.
1114
01:05:58,872 --> 01:06:01,796
I think that he flirted always
with the idea of love.
1115
01:06:01,875 --> 01:06:04,128
I'm not sure
whether he ever achieved it.
1116
01:06:05,503 --> 01:06:08,382
The big thing in his life
that he was in love with was his work.
1117
01:06:08,673 --> 01:06:11,722
And also he didn't trust anyone.
1118
01:06:12,218 --> 01:06:13,561
He thought,
1119
01:06:13,845 --> 01:06:16,724
"If the boyfriend is not here,
it's because he's with someone else."
1120
01:06:16,890 --> 01:06:19,234
And that made him suffer a lot.
1121
01:06:19,767 --> 01:06:23,192
People forget fashion's
always been about attracting a mate.
1122
01:06:23,313 --> 01:06:25,862
H's about sexuality,
showing a person who you are.
1123
01:06:26,024 --> 01:06:28,493
I'm sorry if you think I'm stupid.
1124
01:06:28,818 --> 01:06:31,697
Even though I'm chubby
and I would like to look smaller.
1125
01:06:32,113 --> 01:06:34,081
I mean, let's be realistic here.
1126
01:06:44,334 --> 01:06:46,177
When he changed his appearance,
1127
01:06:46,377 --> 01:06:48,800
he said, "I changed myself.
it was the wrong thing to do.
1128
01:06:49,005 --> 01:06:51,053
"I lost touch with who I was."
1129
01:06:51,591 --> 01:06:55,016
What was it?
Ten years from Lee, little Lee McQueen,
1130
01:06:55,094 --> 01:06:56,937
satin the corner of my studio
sewing away,
1131
01:06:57,180 --> 01:07:00,684
to this svelte figure
dressed in Comme des Gargons,
1132
01:07:01,017 --> 01:07:03,486
having to become something
he didn't really want to be,
1133
01:07:03,728 --> 01:07:06,698
this son' of persona,
this Alexander McQueen.
1134
01:07:34,551 --> 01:07:36,144
6:00 in the morning.
1135
01:07:37,011 --> 01:07:39,764
Don't! Don't do that to her.
Oh, Simon.
1136
01:07:40,098 --> 01:07:42,226
Oh, my God.
1137
01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:44,728
She's only got a few hours left.
1138
01:07:47,689 --> 01:07:49,282
It wasn't fun any more for me.
1139
01:07:49,649 --> 01:07:51,993
That was the bottom line.
It just wasn't fun any more.
1140
01:07:54,612 --> 01:07:56,706
I don't like the camera much.
1141
01:07:56,823 --> 01:07:58,666
Turn it off now.
1142
01:07:59,033 --> 01:08:01,502
I've never done better work
than my time with Lee.
1143
01:08:01,953 --> 01:08:05,708
There was times that were dark with him
and times that were very bright.
1144
01:08:06,165 --> 01:08:09,510
And we all chose it.
We all chose to be there.
1145
01:08:10,044 --> 01:08:12,513
We all chose to not be there
sometimes as well.
1146
01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:14,723
I collapsed once in Givenchy
1147
01:08:15,008 --> 01:08:18,182
because of the pressure
and the workload.
1148
01:08:18,344 --> 01:08:20,938
We had a price to pay
and it was our health.
1149
01:08:21,639 --> 01:08:24,062
I grew in the company,
of course.
1150
01:08:24,309 --> 01:08:27,108
I wasn't the little boy
that I started there.
1151
01:08:27,478 --> 01:08:30,027
As I grew up, I realised that...
1152
01:08:31,107 --> 01:08:35,613
I was feeling like I was a little bit
claustrophobic of the situation.
1153
01:08:36,154 --> 01:08:38,873
Sebastién!
Oh, Sebastién...
1154
01:08:39,073 --> 01:08:40,700
Come on, you ugly bitch.
1155
01:08:41,993 --> 01:08:43,495
Ooh!
1156
01:08:43,828 --> 01:08:46,832
It was like full devotion
to the McQueen house.
1157
01:08:47,373 --> 01:08:49,341
Looking after his dogs,
1158
01:08:49,876 --> 01:08:52,004
endless hours of working
1159
01:08:52,337 --> 01:08:55,216
and weekends either working
1160
01:08:55,340 --> 01:08:57,058
or socialising with Lee.
1161
01:08:57,383 --> 01:09:00,262
We were going also on holiday together.
1162
01:09:00,637 --> 01:09:03,607
I even know how to fake
his signature, you know.
1163
01:09:04,015 --> 01:09:05,983
I was feeling, like, trapped.
1164
01:09:06,893 --> 01:09:09,146
Even if I loved what I was doing.
1165
01:09:10,355 --> 01:09:13,108
I tried to... To speak with him
1166
01:09:13,441 --> 01:09:15,239
and that didn't end up that well.
1167
01:09:15,610 --> 01:09:17,988
The day I told him I was leaving,
he told me,
1168
01:09:18,237 --> 01:09:20,956
"Well, you'd better think about it
because there is no way back."
1169
01:09:23,368 --> 01:09:26,372
And I left and it was really sad,
you know.
1170
01:09:26,496 --> 01:09:29,249
My leaving, you know, it was...
1171
01:09:29,707 --> 01:09:31,175
No one...
1172
01:09:32,543 --> 01:09:35,797
No one, erm...
No one came to...
1173
01:09:37,256 --> 01:09:40,180
After all the work I've done and...
1174
01:09:48,267 --> 01:09:52,067
Unfortunately,
Lee took things quite to heart
1175
01:09:52,772 --> 01:09:54,695
without maybe thinking about
1176
01:09:54,857 --> 01:09:56,530
what the other person was going through
1177
01:09:56,609 --> 01:09:58,156
or what they needed
1178
01:09:58,361 --> 01:09:59,988
and he would take it very personally
1179
01:10:00,196 --> 01:10:02,915
when someone would leave
or he felt betrayed.
1180
01:10:28,683 --> 01:10:32,733
A lot of people around fashion
do suffer from anxiety,
1181
01:10:32,979 --> 01:10:35,277
do suffer from panic attacks,
depression.
1182
01:10:35,648 --> 01:10:38,492
The industry is feeding this ego.
1183
01:10:38,818 --> 01:10:41,162
And it has a very negative effect.
1184
01:10:42,029 --> 01:10:44,908
For the Voss show
the original concept was a padded cell.
1185
01:10:46,325 --> 01:10:50,705
You start losing who you are
and it becomes a darkness
1186
01:10:50,955 --> 01:10:52,582
and a place that you can't get out of.
1187
01:10:53,541 --> 01:10:55,214
And, of course, Lee being Lee,
1188
01:10:55,418 --> 01:10:57,512
he wasn't happy
with just this one great idea.
1189
01:10:57,754 --> 01:11:00,303
You then had to have another box
in the middle
1190
01:11:00,715 --> 01:11:03,969
as a kind of theatrical climax
to the show.
1191
01:11:04,343 --> 01:11:07,643
When he came and sat down
to explain what it was,
1192
01:11:08,055 --> 01:11:10,558
he wouldn't look me in the eye
and he was saying,
1193
01:11:11,017 --> 01:11:14,362
"Yes, it's about death
and beauty and rebirth."
1194
01:11:14,645 --> 01:11:16,192
"It's gonna be beautiful."
1195
01:11:16,647 --> 01:11:19,366
I really wasn't expecting
to be recreating
1196
01:11:19,442 --> 01:11:22,286
Joel-Peter Witkin's
famous incubus image.
1197
01:11:32,872 --> 01:11:34,340
It's a pretty gruesome image
1198
01:11:34,457 --> 01:11:37,210
and I'm thinking, "Oh, my goodness,
am I gonna do this?"
1199
01:11:37,376 --> 01:11:39,174
And I was like, "All right,
then, I will do it,
1200
01:11:39,253 --> 01:11:41,301
"but I want you to know... "
1201
01:11:41,672 --> 01:11:43,720
Serious face.
"...that I'm doing it for an'. "
1202
01:11:45,218 --> 01:11:47,721
And he looked at me like I was mad
1203
01:11:47,887 --> 01:11:49,639
and then he looked away and he went,
1204
01:11:49,847 --> 01:11:51,975
"I thought we all were, weren't we?"
And he was off.
1205
01:11:52,475 --> 01:11:55,979
The actual set had
that Stanley Kubrick 2001
1206
01:11:56,145 --> 01:11:58,318
meets an insane asylum feel.
1207
01:11:58,439 --> 01:12:01,693
And there was a two-way mirror
so that when the fashion people,
1208
01:12:01,901 --> 01:12:04,905
when the fashion press came in
to wait for the show to start,
1209
01:12:05,029 --> 01:12:07,123
they were ail looking
at themselves in the mirror.
1210
01:12:07,406 --> 01:12:10,080
The music started,
ba-dum, ba-dum, ba-dum,
1211
01:12:10,326 --> 01:12:13,250
with this heartbeat
that went faster and faster and faster.
1212
01:12:13,704 --> 01:12:16,378
We didn't know what to expect,
what was gonna happen.
1213
01:12:16,541 --> 01:12:18,293
None of the audience knew at all.
1214
01:12:19,252 --> 01:12:23,598
Fashion is a big bubble
and sometimes I feel like popping it.
1215
01:12:32,348 --> 01:12:34,692
When the show starts,
boom, you can see inside.
1216
01:12:34,892 --> 01:12:36,894
But the models
can't see the audience at all.
1217
01:12:37,812 --> 01:12:40,361
it was suddenly a much more
kind of voyeuristic thing.
1218
01:12:41,858 --> 01:12:43,826
The bandages he put
on a“ the model's heads
1219
01:12:43,943 --> 01:12:48,790
so it had that slight feeling of unease
and sickness and a bed/am feel about it.
1220
01:12:53,870 --> 01:12:57,249
There was one time
that I'd just come out of surgery
1221
01:12:57,456 --> 01:12:59,049
and he came to visit me
1222
01:12:59,458 --> 01:13:02,086
and he saw me
and I had bandages everywhere.
1223
01:13:02,253 --> 01:13:06,008
I was all bruised up and he was like,
"Fucking wicked!", as he would do that.
1224
01:13:06,841 --> 01:13:08,764
He absorbed things like a sponge,
1225
01:13:09,135 --> 01:13:10,887
saw the beauty in the ugly,
1226
01:13:11,137 --> 01:13:13,105
as with the bandages on me.
1227
01:13:39,665 --> 01:13:43,420
Life isn't perfect.
We're not a“ perfect size-zero models.
1228
01:13:43,586 --> 01:13:46,430
But there is beauty
within the eye of the beholder.
1229
01:14:00,770 --> 01:14:03,148
For the final image
to be this one
1230
01:14:03,397 --> 01:14:07,618
of a large woman with moths everywhere,
it sounds like a joke, really.
1231
01:14:07,860 --> 01:14:11,034
But I do think there's a sense of humour
going on underneath there as well.
1232
01:14:11,280 --> 01:14:12,998
It's fat birds and moths.
1233
01:14:13,240 --> 01:14:15,618
I mean, isn't thatjust
fashion's worst nightmare?
1234
01:14:20,665 --> 01:14:23,714
Every season
whose collections do I look at?
1235
01:14:23,793 --> 01:14:25,761
Whose collections
am I jealous of in a sense?
1236
01:14:26,128 --> 01:14:29,348
Whose collections do I think
are absolutely amazing?
1237
01:14:31,467 --> 01:14:34,346
Tom was literally God
In the industry.
1238
01:14:34,679 --> 01:14:36,522
I guess, even if Lee was a rebel
1239
01:14:36,764 --> 01:14:39,313
and he was a totally different
kind of person,
1240
01:14:39,684 --> 01:14:42,528
he probably was flattered
and, you know, touched
1241
01:14:42,728 --> 01:14:46,824
by the fact that someone like Tom Ford
noticed him and wanted him.
1242
01:14:47,316 --> 01:14:49,193
Also he was smart enough to know
1243
01:14:49,443 --> 01:14:51,320
that he needed that financial help.
1244
01:15:09,255 --> 01:15:12,384
The wonderful thing
about Lee is he is poet...
1245
01:15:12,675 --> 01:15:14,393
He won't like this either,
but it's true.
1246
01:15:14,510 --> 01:15:18,140
...poet and commerce united,
because he's very practical.
1247
01:15:18,639 --> 01:15:21,392
So he understands you can express
whatever you want on the runway
1248
01:15:21,726 --> 01:15:24,900
but you need something beautiful
on the hanger to sell to a store.
1249
01:15:26,147 --> 01:15:29,276
Gucci Group was smart.
They saw what the potential was.
1250
01:15:29,525 --> 01:15:32,825
And they offered McQueen a deal
he thought he couldn't refuse
1251
01:15:33,195 --> 01:15:35,323
which was, "Here, we'll underwrite
your company
1252
01:15:35,573 --> 01:15:38,076
"and give you 50% of the ownership."
1253
01:15:38,534 --> 01:15:40,002
They had secret meetings
1254
01:15:40,119 --> 01:15:41,837
so none of it would get back to Arnault
1255
01:15:41,954 --> 01:15:43,297
and the LVMH people.
1256
01:15:43,456 --> 01:15:46,255
They had no idea it was coming
until it hit them.
1257
01:15:48,127 --> 01:15:50,255
I was quite adamant
when I talked to Tom
1258
01:15:50,796 --> 01:15:52,844
that this was a one-man band.
1259
01:15:53,382 --> 01:15:56,261
So they leave you alone
to design what you want?
1260
01:15:56,469 --> 01:15:57,561
Hundred percent.
1261
01:15:57,636 --> 01:15:59,604
I was looking
for major investment
1262
01:16:00,014 --> 01:16:03,234
and then Gucci got in touch and...
1263
01:16:05,019 --> 01:16:06,487
The rest is history.
1264
01:16:10,524 --> 01:16:12,197
Au revoir, Givenchy.
1265
01:16:31,712 --> 01:16:33,180
Got ya!
1266
01:16:48,395 --> 01:16:49,521
What are you doing?
1267
01:16:49,814 --> 01:16:53,318
I have an affinity with the sea.
I don't know, maybe cos I'm Pisces.
1268
01:16:54,193 --> 01:16:56,742
And when it rains and it snows
1269
01:16:57,113 --> 01:17:00,208
and you're near the sea
and you can hear the waves...
1270
01:17:01,325 --> 01:17:04,329
H's very melancholic
but it's very romantic.
1271
01:17:06,997 --> 01:17:09,876
Sometimes you need to have a break
1272
01:17:10,793 --> 01:17:12,261
to get away from everything
1273
01:17:12,378 --> 01:17:16,679
and not to think about business
and fashion shows
1274
01:17:17,091 --> 01:17:19,264
and to take time out.
1275
01:17:25,182 --> 01:17:27,059
I have to be surrounded by nature.
1276
01:17:27,852 --> 01:17:29,229
This is older than the house.
1277
01:17:29,562 --> 01:17:33,317
This is over 400 years old.
It's an elm tree.
1278
01:17:33,691 --> 01:17:36,194
And we uplight it at night.
1279
01:17:39,405 --> 01:17:41,373
And, like, it's good inspiration.
1280
01:17:49,081 --> 01:17:51,254
All my friends come here
and, you know,
1281
01:17:51,542 --> 01:17:55,263
we have the fire on
and we watch DVDs and listen to music.
1282
01:17:56,297 --> 01:17:58,766
It's nice and relaxing.
1283
01:18:06,432 --> 01:18:10,903
He would be spending time
with my mum a lot, down the cottage.
1284
01:18:11,562 --> 01:18:14,441
I'm grateful
that we had that time together.
1285
01:18:15,149 --> 01:18:18,653
We'd see more of each other
and we did things together.
1286
01:18:19,987 --> 01:18:22,206
My family keep me grounded.
1287
01:18:22,448 --> 01:18:24,667
Fashion can be
a very superficial business.
1288
01:18:27,328 --> 01:18:30,127
When I started in London
there was nothing like this.
1289
01:18:30,706 --> 01:18:34,381
It's as close as we can get
to haute couture in England.
1290
01:18:34,960 --> 01:18:37,634
All the people here are students
and it's, like, training them up
1291
01:18:38,005 --> 01:18:41,305
and giving them that initial step
into the world of fashion.
1292
01:18:42,968 --> 01:18:44,891
Lee knew
from when I was a little boy
1293
01:18:45,095 --> 01:18:47,723
that I loved to draw
and I was always very artistic.
1294
01:18:48,390 --> 01:18:51,189
A lot of time had passed
and I was working at a rubbish tip
1295
01:18:51,727 --> 01:18:54,981
and Lee had the position
for a textile designer on menswear
1296
01:18:55,272 --> 01:18:57,024
and that's when he took me on.
1297
01:18:57,524 --> 01:18:59,492
Lee was really happy having me there,
1298
01:19:00,027 --> 01:19:02,155
firstly on the creative level,
1299
01:19:02,363 --> 01:19:04,081
but secondly just having
1300
01:19:05,074 --> 01:19:07,372
something that reminded him of his past
1301
01:19:07,618 --> 01:19:09,495
and his childhood.
1302
01:19:11,372 --> 01:19:12,544
Let's have a look.
1303
01:19:13,540 --> 01:19:17,170
There was a period when it
wasn't so good and I had a lot of angst.
1304
01:19:17,378 --> 01:19:20,006
It was kind of hard. There was a lot
of confliction in my head
1305
01:19:20,339 --> 01:19:23,639
with doing a job that I didn't wanna do,
which was Givenchy.
1306
01:19:23,801 --> 01:19:25,849
But I think I've come to a stage where
1307
01:19:26,387 --> 01:19:29,516
I just accept this is my fife,
this is what I was born to do.
1308
01:19:34,019 --> 01:19:35,396
Oh.
1309
01:19:35,688 --> 01:19:37,907
I like you like this.
1310
01:19:39,149 --> 01:19:41,527
He controlled the vibe
wherever he went.
1311
01:19:41,694 --> 01:19:45,324
A lot of the time he was
such a buzz to be around.
1312
01:19:45,447 --> 01:19:47,620
The way I put it,
it was like he was the queen bee
1313
01:19:47,783 --> 01:19:51,538
with the worker bees responding
to the signals from that queen bee.
1314
01:19:51,704 --> 01:19:53,672
And people felt that, you know.
1315
01:19:53,914 --> 01:19:55,882
He had this kind of childish way
1316
01:19:56,250 --> 01:19:58,753
of mucking about
in the studio environment.
1317
01:19:59,044 --> 01:20:02,548
It just made things so fight
and such a nice place to be.
1318
01:20:03,799 --> 01:20:05,893
There was always
something creative happening.
1319
01:20:06,010 --> 01:20:07,762
That's what excited everybody.
1320
01:20:10,222 --> 01:20:13,647
I speak so loudly
in my work itself, you know.
1321
01:20:13,934 --> 01:20:15,732
I think everything I do is personal.
1322
01:20:15,894 --> 01:20:19,489
Even turning Kate Moss into a hologram
is kind of personal. It's ethereal.
1323
01:20:19,732 --> 01:20:23,202
It's a time I'm feeling at one
with the world and heavenly.
1324
01:20:23,485 --> 01:20:25,704
If you want to know me,
just look at my work.
1325
01:20:44,423 --> 01:20:46,221
What does fashion
mean to you?
1326
01:20:47,217 --> 01:20:48,469
My life.
1327
01:20:54,016 --> 01:20:55,484
Issie died proud,
1328
01:20:55,642 --> 01:20:58,111
having achieved beyond her
wildest dreams.
1329
01:20:58,687 --> 01:21:02,032
The fact that Issie went
was a huge blow to so many people,
1330
01:21:02,274 --> 01:21:03,400
including Alexander.
1331
01:21:03,859 --> 01:21:05,031
A huge blow.
1332
01:21:25,464 --> 01:21:29,514
I saw him at Issie's funeral and
I've never seen anyone so devastated.
1333
01:21:30,886 --> 01:21:32,263
I couldn't recognise him.
1334
01:21:32,346 --> 01:21:35,395
He sat right behind me
and I turned round and saw this person
1335
01:21:35,682 --> 01:21:40,438
in a Highland kilt and a hat,
looking very sad.
1336
01:21:40,562 --> 01:21:42,815
I thought, "My God,
it's McQueen, Alexander."
1337
01:21:43,148 --> 01:21:45,822
And the look on his face was haunting.
1338
01:21:46,402 --> 01:21:47,449
I felt...
1339
01:21:47,653 --> 01:21:49,200
I felt for him.
1340
01:21:49,405 --> 01:21:52,249
You could just feel...
You could just see the pain.
1341
01:21:53,158 --> 01:21:54,375
He suffered.
1342
01:21:54,618 --> 01:21:55,665
I could see the love.
1343
01:21:55,869 --> 01:21:57,337
Never deny the love.
1344
01:21:57,496 --> 01:21:59,874
It was such a love affair
between those two.
1345
01:22:03,335 --> 01:22:05,178
Issie seemed to slot in
1346
01:22:05,295 --> 01:22:07,423
between a sister and a mum.
1347
01:22:08,465 --> 01:22:13,312
She was in the middle
and Lee just loved Issie.
1348
01:22:14,763 --> 01:22:17,232
The connection
between Issie and McQueen...
1349
01:22:17,599 --> 01:22:19,317
They both carried sadnesses.
1350
01:22:20,018 --> 01:22:21,611
Alexander had been abused.
1351
01:22:21,728 --> 01:22:25,323
He felt that person
had destroyed his innocence.
1352
01:22:25,691 --> 01:22:28,865
Issie had this very sad instance
when she was about five years old
1353
01:22:29,153 --> 01:22:31,326
when her brother
that she was playing with died.
1354
01:22:31,530 --> 01:22:34,500
Not Issie's fault,
but she always felt responsible for him
1355
01:22:34,783 --> 01:22:36,376
and carried that guilt.
1356
01:22:36,493 --> 01:22:39,372
There was a destructive side
and destructive issues
1357
01:22:39,496 --> 01:22:42,716
which she could never resolve entirely
and they would blow up.
1358
01:22:43,709 --> 01:22:45,552
It became more and more serious.
1359
01:22:46,336 --> 01:22:48,338
I don't take drugs,
but I take medication.
1360
01:22:48,589 --> 01:22:52,184
I mean, sometimes I have to take a pill,
just to keep me calm.
1361
01:22:52,551 --> 01:22:56,226
The pathway
to her self-destruction was clear.
1362
01:22:57,097 --> 01:23:00,727
Issie, perhaps, was thinking
she didn't want to go on forever.
1363
01:23:01,185 --> 01:23:03,233
She couldn't rein vent herself
as an old woman
1364
01:23:03,353 --> 01:23:05,026
cos fashion's all about youth.
1365
01:23:05,355 --> 01:23:08,529
Discovering people is a big thing.
It's like being a mother.
1366
01:23:09,026 --> 01:23:10,994
And the milk's dried up.
1367
01:23:11,862 --> 01:23:13,705
Issie was planning her death.
1368
01:23:14,656 --> 01:23:16,658
So she wanted
to say goodbye to McQueen.
1369
01:23:18,368 --> 01:23:20,746
And she organised a weekend.
1370
01:23:21,163 --> 01:23:24,463
She'd gone to a lot of trouble
with a very lovely menu.
1371
01:23:26,293 --> 01:23:28,170
And Alexander was exhausted
when he turned up
1372
01:23:28,462 --> 01:23:30,089
and just stayed in his room.
1373
01:23:31,882 --> 01:23:34,886
Whatever she needed,
he wasn't able to give it himself.
1374
01:23:35,719 --> 01:23:39,599
But they did see each other, yeah.
There was a farewell between them.
1375
01:23:39,765 --> 01:23:41,642
Big hug and kiss and...
1376
01:23:42,142 --> 01:23:43,940
"See you in the next world."
I don't know.
1377
01:23:44,186 --> 01:23:47,190
The thing is, when you're ill,
you don't know...
1378
01:23:47,523 --> 01:23:48,570
You're very alone.
1379
01:23:48,815 --> 01:23:51,068
Issie had ovarian cancer
at the end.
1380
01:23:51,401 --> 01:23:54,575
If it was terminal, who knows.
She wasn't interested in chemotherapy.
1381
01:23:56,657 --> 01:23:58,159
The last thing Issie said to me,
1382
01:23:58,825 --> 01:24:02,250
"Do you remember, Detmar,
when I was a ray of sunshine?"
1383
01:24:02,329 --> 01:24:04,707
And I said,
"You'll always be a ray of sunshine."
1384
01:24:08,835 --> 01:24:11,338
McQueen is calling his show
"La Dame Bleue."
1385
01:24:11,672 --> 01:24:13,140
He's dedicating this show
1386
01:24:13,257 --> 01:24:17,558
to his late great friend
and mentor, Isabella Blow.
1387
01:24:17,678 --> 01:24:19,897
You could see her
in the clothes.
1388
01:24:20,055 --> 01:24:22,808
You could smell
the perfume of her around.
1389
01:24:22,891 --> 01:24:26,111
And you could see her children,
in a way, backstage,
1390
01:24:26,770 --> 01:24:29,193
Alexander and Philip
going crazy together.
1391
01:24:29,481 --> 01:24:31,529
What bonded them was Issie.
1392
01:24:32,359 --> 01:24:35,659
Isabella single-handedly invented
Alexander and myself
1393
01:24:35,946 --> 01:24:37,323
from nowhere
1394
01:24:37,948 --> 01:24:42,704
with such conviction that...
We will never experience again.
1395
01:24:43,245 --> 01:24:48,126
Her belief in you made you be
the person you are.
1396
01:25:07,728 --> 01:25:11,403
Bomb Once you sat down
and you saw the set and the music,
1397
01:25:12,149 --> 01:25:14,698
you were there and it held you,
1398
01:25:15,068 --> 01:25:18,743
because I kept seeing her in the clothes
that he was putting on the catwalk
1399
01:25:19,072 --> 01:25:21,916
and the hats, of course,
that Philip was designing.
1400
01:25:25,370 --> 01:25:30,297
It was actually creating
some mythical figure
1401
01:25:30,584 --> 01:25:33,758
that was like Issie's presence
at the show.
1402
01:25:41,887 --> 01:25:43,184
So emotional.
1403
01:25:43,722 --> 01:25:45,224
I just couldn't stop crying,
1404
01:25:45,682 --> 01:25:47,400
just bent over double.
1405
01:25:47,476 --> 01:25:48,944
And, erm...
1406
01:25:49,686 --> 01:25:51,484
Grief is grief.
You have to go through it.
1407
01:25:57,569 --> 01:26:01,039
And then to see them come on
and realise how young they were
1408
01:26:01,365 --> 01:26:03,413
and they had lost a great friend
1409
01:26:03,867 --> 01:26:05,869
and how they had loved her.
1410
01:26:12,584 --> 01:26:15,087
I think it had a big effect
on Lee.
1411
01:26:16,296 --> 01:26:18,970
After Issie passed away,
1412
01:26:19,716 --> 01:26:23,596
he was in a really dark place.
1413
01:26:40,529 --> 01:26:43,453
We were watching TV
in the evening
1414
01:26:43,699 --> 01:26:46,293
and Lee McQueen
opened the news that day
1415
01:26:46,451 --> 01:26:48,579
with the Horn of Plenty show.
1416
01:26:50,163 --> 01:26:54,464
And my father was sitting there
and he's like, “Sebastian, come over.
1417
01:26:54,668 --> 01:26:57,512
"I think it's your crazy friend's
fashion on TV."
1418
01:26:58,046 --> 01:27:01,220
And when my father
saw the collection, he was like,
1419
01:27:02,050 --> 01:27:04,553
"I think your friend
has gone really mad."
1420
01:27:07,472 --> 01:27:09,975
And I think with Horn of Plenty
1421
01:27:10,225 --> 01:27:12,694
that really reflects
the fashion world today,
1422
01:27:13,562 --> 01:27:14,688
a pile of crap.
1423
01:27:21,862 --> 01:27:24,365
Three years of being apart,
1424
01:27:24,531 --> 01:27:27,751
I think a lot and I think
he thinks a lot also.
1425
01:27:29,244 --> 01:27:33,090
And when I called him,
it was like, "Hello, Lee?"
1426
01:27:33,540 --> 01:27:35,042
"Hello?"
1427
01:27:35,292 --> 01:27:36,635
"Lee, it's Sebastién."
1428
01:27:36,752 --> 01:27:40,632
"Where the fuck have you been
all this time, you fucking bastard?"
1429
01:27:41,339 --> 01:27:46,891
We just started again like...
Like the brothers we were before.
1430
01:27:48,013 --> 01:27:50,391
So then I took the ferry to Ibiza
1431
01:27:50,807 --> 01:27:52,684
and I went to his villa.
1432
01:27:52,934 --> 01:27:56,609
When he opened the door,
I was in shock
1433
01:27:56,855 --> 01:28:00,155
because the person
who opened the door,
1434
01:28:00,484 --> 01:28:03,328
he was a different person,
he was really skinny
1435
01:28:03,612 --> 01:28:07,617
and looking very fragile
and very, very pale.
1436
01:28:08,200 --> 01:28:11,500
When I hugged him,
that's when I noticed
1437
01:28:11,661 --> 01:28:14,210
something has changed because...
1438
01:28:14,623 --> 01:28:17,672
His body structure was just bones.
1439
01:28:18,043 --> 01:28:21,798
There was hardly any muscle
or flesh there.
1440
01:28:24,633 --> 01:28:28,809
Lee come in with the idea
of having an invitation for a show
1441
01:28:28,929 --> 01:28:30,931
that had that metamorphosis.
1442
01:28:31,097 --> 01:28:34,692
He wanted his face
to transform into a skull.
1443
01:28:35,435 --> 01:28:40,407
Everything in his life had just led
to these feelings of torment.
1444
01:28:41,316 --> 01:28:43,489
Lee was HIV positive.
1445
01:28:44,361 --> 01:28:47,535
Even though it isn't
a death sentence as such,
1446
01:28:48,240 --> 01:28:51,414
I think it was always
in the back of Lee's mind.
1447
01:28:51,868 --> 01:28:54,371
You'd feel the bad vibes
when Lee was down.
1448
01:28:54,621 --> 01:28:58,171
There was a real depression
that was brought with that as well.
1449
01:29:11,054 --> 01:29:13,148
I think the trouble is with Lee,
1450
01:29:13,390 --> 01:29:17,236
after a show, when you've done
that build-up and you've worked hard,
1451
01:29:17,477 --> 01:29:21,323
you could see
there was a little bit of a down.
1452
01:29:23,692 --> 01:29:25,194
And then onto the next show.
1453
01:29:25,861 --> 01:29:26,908
Again.
1454
01:29:28,363 --> 01:29:32,163
Yeah, it was just show after show.
I don't know how Lee did it.
1455
01:29:37,372 --> 01:29:41,047
The pressures
kind of quite immense now
1456
01:29:41,293 --> 01:29:45,014
because of the Gucci contract
and, erm...
1457
01:29:46,339 --> 01:29:47,386
You know, the...
1458
01:29:47,674 --> 01:29:50,974
I do the men's now
and now I also do McQ,
1459
01:29:51,219 --> 01:29:53,722
so it's about 14 collections
a year again,
1460
01:29:53,930 --> 01:29:57,810
same as when I was at Givenchy,
so it's hard work.
1461
01:30:04,149 --> 01:30:06,322
He would have liked
the idea of moving away
1462
01:30:06,484 --> 01:30:08,031
and just leaving everything behind,
1463
01:30:08,320 --> 01:30:12,200
but as it was his name above the door
and his reputation as a person
1464
01:30:12,365 --> 01:30:15,710
and everything he had built,
he couldn't just abandon it.
1465
01:30:22,542 --> 01:30:25,921
If I ever get that old and I'm still
around and I leave my company,
1466
01:30:26,713 --> 01:30:30,092
I'll just burn the place down
so there's no one working there.
1467
01:30:30,383 --> 01:30:33,136
Really?
So you'd never let someone carry on
1468
01:30:33,762 --> 01:30:36,606
the McQueen tradition
or the McQueen brand
1469
01:30:36,723 --> 01:30:38,600
if you weren't actively involved?
1470
01:30:39,309 --> 01:30:40,401
Erm...
1471
01:30:41,311 --> 01:30:43,564
I don't think so. I mean, it doesn't...
1472
01:30:44,230 --> 01:30:47,951
It... Because that person will have
to come up with the concepts for my show
1473
01:30:48,109 --> 01:30:49,986
and my shows are so personal.
1474
01:30:50,070 --> 01:30:51,617
How can... How can that be?
1475
01:30:53,281 --> 01:30:56,330
I said, "Why don't you
just step away, Lee, for a year?"
1476
01:30:56,910 --> 01:30:58,457
And he just said,
"You don't understand."
1477
01:30:58,536 --> 01:31:01,756
He said, "I'm responsible
for 50 people.
1478
01:31:01,998 --> 01:31:05,127
"They've got to pay their mortgages.
I can't just stop."
1479
01:31:08,046 --> 01:31:09,889
I was always thinking
1480
01:31:10,048 --> 01:31:12,471
there's so much sadness in him,
1481
01:31:12,717 --> 01:31:14,560
and that was sad, you know,
1482
01:31:14,719 --> 01:31:19,190
because he was this successful,
flamboyant being
1483
01:31:19,432 --> 01:31:21,355
who actually was so lonely deep inside.
1484
01:31:21,601 --> 01:31:24,229
It can be. It can be really lonely.
1485
01:31:24,562 --> 01:31:26,155
And I think...
1486
01:31:26,564 --> 01:31:29,693
You know, I think
there's more to life than fashion
1487
01:31:30,068 --> 01:31:33,197
and I don't want to be stuck
in that bubble of, "This is what I do."
1488
01:31:33,321 --> 01:31:37,042
It's nice because you see
everyone in the office.
1489
01:31:37,283 --> 01:31:39,206
They go home
and they can shut off
1490
01:31:39,661 --> 01:31:42,505
but I'm still Alexander McQueen
after I shut the door.
1491
01:31:42,789 --> 01:31:45,463
Do you know what I mean?
I've got to go home with myself, so...
1492
01:31:46,084 --> 01:31:47,677
You know,
if you've had a bad day,
1493
01:31:47,794 --> 01:31:50,343
I've only got myself
to answer to, so...
1494
01:31:59,180 --> 01:32:03,105
I mean, with us,
he was, like, behaving...
1495
01:32:04,102 --> 01:32:05,604
All right, OK,
1496
01:32:06,438 --> 01:32:10,659
but deep inside
we knew that he wasn't...
1497
01:32:12,569 --> 01:32:14,242
He wasn't 100%.
1498
01:32:14,821 --> 01:32:16,949
He could hear voices.
1499
01:32:17,115 --> 01:32:20,619
He was telling me
that they were chasing him.
1500
01:32:21,536 --> 01:32:23,379
One thing he used to say,
1501
01:32:23,538 --> 01:32:25,882
"Paranoia will destroy ya."
1502
01:32:26,708 --> 01:32:28,927
I remember doing a drawing
1503
01:32:29,377 --> 01:32:32,051
which, basically, has got
lots of cameras around.
1504
01:32:32,213 --> 01:32:34,557
We're thinking, "Maybe
the cameras could be on robots."
1505
01:32:34,841 --> 01:32:37,344
It was always about
getting the camera right in your face
1506
01:32:37,552 --> 01:32:40,852
and it's surveillance,
making the audience a bit uncomfortable.
1507
01:32:41,556 --> 01:32:43,399
The idea behind Plato's Atlantis
1508
01:32:43,475 --> 01:32:46,445
is where people come from the land
and go back into the sea.
1509
01:33:00,200 --> 01:33:02,294
He loved swimming, scuba diving.
1510
01:33:02,494 --> 01:33:05,589
He loved that feeling of just being
in a different world unden/vater,
1511
01:33:06,206 --> 01:33:07,708
just away from everything,
1512
01:33:07,832 --> 01:33:10,176
almost like you're back in the womb,
floating.
1513
01:33:10,543 --> 01:33:14,389
You know? And that kind of serenity
you would get through that.
1514
01:33:15,340 --> 01:33:18,719
Plato's Atlantis
was kind of like a study in his head
1515
01:33:18,968 --> 01:33:20,845
with all the digital printing
1516
01:33:21,304 --> 01:33:24,228
and all the experimenting,
pattern-cutting.
1517
01:33:24,599 --> 01:33:27,899
And the robots were there again.
1518
01:33:28,228 --> 01:33:32,278
He said to me, "I designed
my last coflection, Sebastian."
1519
01:33:32,857 --> 01:33:35,781
And he told me,
"I've had enough with all this.
1520
01:33:36,611 --> 01:33:38,409
"I am gonna kill myself."
1521
01:33:39,197 --> 01:33:41,871
"What do you mean,
you're gonna kill yourself?"
1522
01:33:42,283 --> 01:33:44,456
He's like, "Yeah, I...
1523
01:33:44,536 --> 01:33:47,380
"I am fed up. I've had it with this.
1524
01:33:47,539 --> 01:33:49,541
"L just wanna put an end to it.
1525
01:33:49,833 --> 01:33:53,383
"And in my last show,
in the end..."
1526
01:33:53,545 --> 01:33:55,013
He said,
"Do you remember Voss?
1527
01:33:55,797 --> 01:33:57,891
"So, I'm gonna do
the same sort of thing,
1528
01:33:58,424 --> 01:34:02,179
"but it's going to be a Perspex box
the size of a human being.
1529
01:34:02,303 --> 01:34:03,555
"So, when the show ends,
1530
01:34:03,721 --> 01:34:07,567
"this box is gonna come up
from the ground
1531
01:34:08,893 --> 01:34:10,895
"with me inside.
1532
01:34:11,020 --> 01:34:12,693
"And then I'm just...
1533
01:34:12,814 --> 01:34:14,566
"I'm just gonna
shoot myself."
1534
01:34:15,984 --> 01:34:17,031
And...
1535
01:34:18,778 --> 01:34:20,200
And I...
1536
01:34:20,363 --> 01:34:23,492
I mean, I just didn't know
what to... How to react to that.
1537
01:34:23,616 --> 01:34:25,368
You know what I mean?
Because“.
1538
01:34:26,161 --> 01:34:27,708
He sounded so convinced.
1539
01:34:38,506 --> 01:34:40,554
It was like he thought
1540
01:34:40,925 --> 01:34:45,522
that the whole fashion "system"
was against him.
1541
01:34:46,222 --> 01:34:49,021
And I said, "No, no one is against you.
1542
01:34:49,851 --> 01:34:53,196
"But if you are thinking to do this,
1543
01:34:53,313 --> 01:34:55,691
"you're gonna harm so many people
1544
01:34:56,191 --> 01:34:59,070
"because people come
to your shows to see your beauty,
1545
01:34:59,485 --> 01:35:02,159
"your talent, your creativity and
1546
01:35:03,573 --> 01:35:05,541
"to see you, to see your work."
1547
01:35:22,342 --> 01:35:24,219
He was like a movie director.
1548
01:35:24,510 --> 01:35:27,309
We had to be like aliens
and he told us this.
1549
01:35:27,513 --> 01:35:29,891
He said, "Listen, you have
to have this face.
1550
01:35:30,308 --> 01:35:32,731
"Strong, you know.
You have to be powerful."
1551
01:35:32,894 --> 01:35:35,363
With this show,
he kind of threw a bomb on us.
1552
01:35:35,480 --> 01:35:37,858
"OK, this is it. Finished.
Everything is finished.
1553
01:35:38,024 --> 01:35:39,867
"We are reborn. We're starting anew.
1554
01:35:40,026 --> 01:35:41,573
"New chapter, new planet."
1555
01:35:54,540 --> 01:35:56,838
I was really scared.
1556
01:35:56,960 --> 01:35:59,088
I tried not to picture myself falling.
1557
01:35:59,712 --> 01:36:01,339
I wanted him to be proud of me
1558
01:36:01,464 --> 01:36:03,887
and I wanted him to be proud
1559
01:36:04,259 --> 01:36:07,183
that he has such an army of models.
1560
01:36:14,102 --> 01:36:15,854
Endless print designs.
1561
01:36:15,979 --> 01:36:19,483
It might have been a fish's fin
or scales from a snake,
1562
01:36:20,024 --> 01:36:23,574
and then manipulated and montaged
1563
01:36:23,695 --> 01:36:26,039
into a repeat pattern.
1564
01:36:26,197 --> 01:36:28,871
And it became something else,
unrecognisable.
1565
01:36:29,284 --> 01:36:32,663
This was the turn of the digital age
coming into fashion.
1566
01:36:34,205 --> 01:36:36,799
It towards the end
he wasn't that happy,
1567
01:36:37,083 --> 01:36:40,383
why his best collection is there?
1568
01:36:48,553 --> 01:36:52,183
He knew he needed
something revolutionary.
1569
01:36:52,724 --> 01:36:55,694
And I think
Plato's Atlantis is, I'm sorry.
1570
01:37:06,446 --> 01:37:09,871
I didn't go to Plato,
my mum not being well.
1571
01:37:10,033 --> 01:37:12,001
She was on dialysis at the time.
1572
01:37:12,327 --> 01:37:16,503
Lee didn't really want to face the fact
that we was gonna lose Mum.
1573
01:37:16,581 --> 01:37:19,050
Because he'd lost Issie,
1574
01:37:19,167 --> 01:37:21,215
he wasn't, erm,
1575
01:37:22,545 --> 01:37:25,298
dealing with Mum not being well.
1576
01:37:35,850 --> 01:37:38,979
After my grandmother Joyce
passed away,
1577
01:37:40,938 --> 01:37:42,940
he was in really bad shape.
1578
01:37:43,524 --> 01:37:45,401
Lee was distraught.
1579
01:37:45,860 --> 01:37:48,534
We was sitting
in the living room at my dad's
1580
01:37:49,864 --> 01:37:52,868
and he didn't look himself at all,
Lee.
1581
01:37:54,160 --> 01:37:58,210
I mean, we was all taking
my mum's passing bad.
1582
01:37:59,207 --> 01:38:04,134
I think we was all worried about Lee
because obviously Mum and Lee...
1583
01:38:06,547 --> 01:38:08,390
Lee idolised my mum.
1584
01:38:19,852 --> 01:38:21,946
The lastjob he gave me to do
1585
01:38:22,063 --> 01:38:24,486
was designing the gravestone.
1586
01:38:25,817 --> 01:38:28,696
He liked the idea of the wings
wrapping round the gravestone
1587
01:38:28,820 --> 01:38:31,949
to kind of embrace
my grandmother Joyce.
1588
01:38:33,199 --> 01:38:35,167
Originally, I had hands
1589
01:38:35,284 --> 01:38:37,958
which were facing down
on top of the gravestone.
1590
01:38:38,287 --> 01:38:43,464
But the hands for him facing down
was holding them down.
1591
01:38:43,751 --> 01:38:46,504
He wanted them uplifted,
so he turned the hands upwards.
1592
01:38:50,633 --> 01:38:52,635
I called Lee
1593
01:38:52,927 --> 01:38:54,270
and
1594
01:38:55,471 --> 01:38:57,223
we spoke about
1595
01:38:58,224 --> 01:39:00,226
Mum's funeral and...
1596
01:39:01,561 --> 01:39:03,859
And that was the last conversation.
1597
01:39:19,871 --> 01:39:21,214
The night...
1598
01:39:21,372 --> 01:39:24,216
Iwas in bed,
I was reading, and I felt...
1599
01:39:25,042 --> 01:39:27,010
I felt something touch my head.
1600
01:39:28,379 --> 01:39:30,473
Very softly and very gently.
1601
01:39:30,548 --> 01:39:33,051
I touched my head
and I said to myself,
1602
01:39:33,551 --> 01:39:35,474
"Who's here? Who are you?"
1603
01:39:36,053 --> 01:39:39,557
I knew someone had passed
and was saying goodbye.
1604
01:39:59,660 --> 01:40:03,881
I got a call at half past 9:00
in the morning
1605
01:40:04,040 --> 01:40:05,542
from my sister.
1606
01:40:05,666 --> 01:40:08,169
And then that phone call...
1607
01:40:10,046 --> 01:40:12,390
Just changed...
1608
01:40:13,883 --> 01:40:15,100
Everything.
1609
01:40:16,427 --> 01:40:18,600
I just really couldn't believe
what I was hearing
1610
01:40:18,763 --> 01:40:21,892
because itjust seemed so surreal
in that moment.
1611
01:40:24,393 --> 01:40:29,866
Just the vision in my mind
of Lee being sort of all alone
1612
01:40:29,982 --> 01:40:31,575
and doing that as well
1613
01:40:31,692 --> 01:40:34,366
was playing through my mind,
you know, and it's quite...
1614
01:40:35,696 --> 01:40:37,073
Er...
1615
01:40:37,198 --> 01:40:39,917
It's not the nicest way to go, you know.
1616
01:40:40,701 --> 01:40:42,749
Suicide, alone, hanging.
1617
01:40:43,454 --> 01:40:45,206
It's, erm...
1618
01:40:46,290 --> 01:40:49,169
I just don't want to think
what was going through his mind,
1619
01:40:49,418 --> 01:40:52,092
how lonely he must have been as well,
doing it.
1620
01:41:01,347 --> 01:41:03,270
The fashion world
is in shock
1621
01:41:03,516 --> 01:41:05,894
over news that Alexander McQueen
has died...
1622
01:41:06,102 --> 01:41:09,276
The darling of British
fashion has been found dead after...
1623
01:41:26,539 --> 01:41:28,166
He used to say that a lot.
1624
01:41:28,332 --> 01:41:29,959
"One day
1625
01:41:30,126 --> 01:41:33,676
"I'm gonna come home
inside a body bag."
1626
01:41:35,881 --> 01:41:37,883
And that day when...
1627
01:41:40,052 --> 01:41:43,226
The news opened again
that day
1628
01:41:43,389 --> 01:41:46,518
of him leaving his house
inside a body bag.
1629
01:41:52,940 --> 01:41:57,821
I'd taken my kids
to Hamleys' 100th-year celebration
1630
01:41:58,154 --> 01:42:00,748
and my partner picked me up and said,
1631
01:42:00,906 --> 01:42:01,953
"I've got..."
1632
01:42:02,199 --> 01:42:05,043
I can't do it. It'll just be really
silly. I'll just cry.
1633
01:42:05,453 --> 01:42:08,002
He said, "Lee's dead."
1634
01:42:08,372 --> 01:42:11,000
And it was just such a shock
1635
01:42:11,417 --> 01:42:14,796
and I was so angry
for a really long time.
1636
01:42:15,046 --> 01:42:17,265
Because you think just...
"How do you...
1637
01:42:17,757 --> 01:42:20,135
"How did that happen?"
You know? He's...
1638
01:42:21,802 --> 01:42:23,054
I think that
1639
01:42:25,389 --> 01:42:28,233
perhaps after my mum went
1640
01:42:28,392 --> 01:42:33,865
that he felt there was nothing
that could make him happy any more.
1641
01:42:34,774 --> 01:42:38,699
And I just think it was
in that moment that
1642
01:42:40,863 --> 01:42:43,366
he had that emptiness.
1643
01:42:45,159 --> 01:42:47,082
I miss him a lot, yeah.
1644
01:42:47,703 --> 01:42:51,082
I miss that... That... You know...
1645
01:42:51,791 --> 01:42:54,795
He could have had, like,
some really great happiness in his life
1646
01:42:54,877 --> 01:42:58,006
and he didn't quite have that
in his personal life.
1647
01:42:58,214 --> 01:43:02,139
And... That's what I wish...
Wished for him most.
1648
01:43:02,968 --> 01:43:04,220
Yeah.
1649
01:43:08,391 --> 01:43:11,611
I'm so happy I got to...
1650
01:43:12,812 --> 01:43:14,689
To meet him and to...
1651
01:43:16,440 --> 01:43:18,192
To share
1652
01:43:18,734 --> 01:43:22,284
part of my life with his story
and everything.
1653
01:43:23,364 --> 01:43:24,786
But I miss him.
1654
01:43:24,865 --> 01:43:26,367
I wish
1655
01:43:27,493 --> 01:43:30,713
things ended in a different way.
1656
01:43:46,387 --> 01:43:48,435
He wanted to make
really beautiful things
1657
01:43:48,639 --> 01:43:50,141
and he sculpted in clothing.
1658
01:43:50,391 --> 01:43:52,064
He was a sculptor really, I think,
1659
01:43:52,351 --> 01:43:54,149
and that's where that silhouette
came from.
1660
01:43:56,021 --> 01:43:59,195
His clothes made me feel
that you could be feminine,
1661
01:43:59,400 --> 01:44:03,200
but at the same time, you know,
"Don't fuck with me, I'm a bitch."
1662
01:44:07,199 --> 01:44:11,420
The thing I remember best
is seeing him working.
1663
01:44:12,163 --> 01:44:13,836
It was magical.
1664
01:44:14,123 --> 01:44:16,876
For me, he was like a magician.
1665
01:44:20,379 --> 01:44:22,677
One outfit would just be insane
1666
01:44:22,965 --> 01:44:25,639
and then the next one
would just be genius.
1667
01:44:27,178 --> 01:44:32,730
Nobody could create emotions
in a show like Lee McQueen did.
1668
01:44:35,478 --> 01:44:39,153
Fashion for Lee was a way
of just communicating a whole world
1669
01:44:39,273 --> 01:44:42,447
and he wanted to take himself
out of the picture,
1670
01:44:42,526 --> 01:44:46,030
for people just to focus
on this art that he was creating.
1671
01:44:47,490 --> 01:44:51,916
Raucous, bolshie,
incredibly funny, incredibly driven.
1672
01:44:52,369 --> 01:44:56,840
Not only did he have a singular vision,
but he was a very singular individual.
1673
01:44:57,166 --> 01:45:01,171
And his strength of personality
was quite phenomenal.
1674
01:45:01,796 --> 01:45:04,219
You just don't see
many people like that.
1675
01:45:04,548 --> 01:45:07,017
They don't...
They don't come up very often.